Help me make a life changing decision; Canada or the US?

[Z]

Serious posts only, please.


I am planning to permanently move to North America. I need help on deciding if Canada or the US is a better choice.

Here are the reasons why I want to go with each:

Canada:
Main reason is the health system is forgiving. i.e.: you can't go bankrupt on medical bills and you can still get decent care even if you were unemployed, bankrupt or have no money/can't afford it.

The secondary reason is that it is easier to get residency than the US.

The US:
basically everything else.

The secondary reason is that I don't feel second place when it comes to services, prices, etc. i.e.: services and products launch in the US first and are probably cheaper. Many are exclusively available in the US mainland. These may be little things, but they do pile up and make you take a psychological note.


Can some fellow Canadians, Americans and others who have experience help me decide please? I have been doing a lot of research on my own, of course, but I'll take all the help I can get.

PS. Please don't turn this into a nationalistic pissing contest. I really seek advice here.

[Lucent Beam]

Make a good friend in the US that will give you an in on those product deals and move to Canada instead.

[Bryan]

Canada is pretty sweet if you'd like to have a very safe place to live. And if you like maple syrup, beer, hockey, and Frenchmen.

The United States has opportunity out the ass, though. In places you can access everything except Frenchmen, which I feel could be considered heaven on Earth.

At any rate, get yourself over here. If Canada is easier to get into, then go for it. If you decide to move the the US, you can always do that later.

[Dark_Cloud]

Well, it all depends. Where are you living now? The thing about US and Canada are that they are so huge that it really all depends on where you live. You could probably find similar weather and familiar surroundings. I live in the northwest of USA, and it's pretty much same weather as London. But you can find any type. My personal recommendation would be to move to Vancouver BC. It's one of the most expensive places to live, but it is also my favorite city. If you can handle constant rain, it's a blast.

[JasonXe]

I wouldn't mind Canada if i could live in a remote area with a big lake.

I'm dieing to move to Florida though cause nyc is poopie.

[Coded-Dude]

Where in each country are you planning on residing? Or are you just trying to decide which country in general? I would say Canada is a good choice for your reasons, just move close tot he border so you can visit the US whenever you like.

[Carlos]

The thing you want to ask yourself right now: What do you want to be when you "grow" up? I know you're old enough to think on your own, but what I meant is, where do you see YOURSELF in the future?

For example, if you wanted to be a game tester, game designer, graphics designer, the US has plenty of opportunity in those areas. Canada has a few game companies up there. Not to mention a few game shops.

Violence in Canada is pretty much the same as US. I know a few people already have reported crime in toronto (like most populated cities). There's no such thing as "safe places to live." Each city has its ups and downs, and each city has a criminal.

And finally, what can you tolerate? Rain? Storms? Earthquakes?

In california, its sunny most of the year, sometimes we get rain, sometimes we get cloudy days, if we haven't gotten a good rain in the year, we get thunderstorms. Some areas of US has tornados, and many LOVE to see tornadoes and stay close to those areas. But be prepared to suck up and pay for a new house if yours get hit.

Florida has hurricanes, and is mostly sunny like california, but that's where the differences lies.

Job market? There's no job market right now, we're in a huge recession. Its not going away any time soon. You can ask me about that one, ever since I left my job two years ago, I haven't gotten a job. Nope. Nothing. The job market is that bad right now.

[Soda Jones]

If you don't mind I'd like to ask a few questions before giving advice.

Where are you coming from?
What career or education are you pursuing?
Is there any specific climate or community you are interested in?

[Hisham]

Whereabouts do you want to live in either country? I'd say only consider moving to Canada if you get to come to Southern Ontario or the Vancouver area.

Southern Ontario is very good because if you live around Toronto, making a trip down to Buffalo for a day is doable (2 hour drive or so).

[frosty]

US has better weather than canada (just about every climate type on earth can be found here), by far. Canada has better healthcare, although it does look like obama's public option insurance is doing ok, so that might change soon. US is in a bit of an economic crunch (as is the rest of the world), so finding work won't be as easy as it could be elsewhere (no idea about canada). US has a bit more to do overall, a bit more cultural diversity as well.

[bobo_ess]

Canada is a little more lenient on pot, WW1 was the last time we had any conscription to the army.

prescription drugs are cheaper, no death penalty, we are part of the commonwealth, which means we don't require a passport to visit other commonwealth nations.

It's very culturally diverse, you'll see.

And last, but not least, we have a french backside to everything we buy!!!

[OG_Monkey]

Well first of we needa no jut where in the US or Canada do you want to move to? Or do you want ideas?

[Viper]

Z, you can get full medical care (and sometimes monetary coverage too) in the US by simply going to state or religious based hospitals and clinics. You will be in debt for the bills (unless you get the aforementioned monetary coverage as well) but they will not deny you care.

I suggest the US; particularly the southern states of Florida and Texas. Their diversity, climate, resilience against the recession, business opportunities and lower cost of living make it the most attractive locations in the continental US.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

The best thing I can say about Virginia's job market is, 'at least we're not Detroit.' But other than that it's pretty nice here. Central VA and Northern VA are where it's at. Northern Va's standard of living starts to climb a bit though. Cultural diversity isn't even a question.

[Soda Jones]

Having the opportunity to travel outside the US regularly I can safely say that what we as Americans view as a 'jobless' or 'weak market' is golden compared to a lot of countries out there. The world economy is struggling but I wouldn't say America is taking the biggest hit.

Canada can guarantee you health care but in America, if you're willing to risk it, you can likely find a job that will provide health care. If you have a bachelors degree and/or experience in your given field you have a decent shot at getting something that fulfills your needs.

I can't speak for Canada's economy or job opportunities. Either country it's going to be competitive to get a good job.

I live in the Pacific Northwest and I can definitely give it a big thumbs up. The cool thing about America is that you can go just about anywhere and it's going to be very diverse in both people and cuisine. The Pacific Northwest is known for its very active citizens involved in skiing, biking, kayaking, marathons, etc.

If I could recommend a place to avoid it would be the eastern half of America. No offense to those over there but I've found that all that racism I read about and saw on television can be found a lot more prevalent when you head to the east. There are some deep hurts on both sides and the result is a general mistrust and even outward animosity from both blacks and whites. This is not evident in everyone or even in the majority of people. It is, however, IMO still very much there. The west side of America doesn't seem to have as many racism issues. It's not really thought about much around here. I never had to think about racism much until I first moved over to the east coast...it was just never an issue where I've lived (Washington, Oregon, California, Arizona).

[Z]

I don't mind any weather or geographical location to live in. I eat anything so I don't care about cuisine choices. I have no religion (guess that makes me an atheist). I am single and have no dependents. I'm in my late 20's with a Masters degree in Education, but I don't care what kind of job I get as long as I can feed my self and live under a roof- which is why Canada's health system is a big plus for me since I may be broke. I could spend the rest of my life washing dishes and I'll still be happy. I just want to get the fuck out of where I am now since I can't take it any longer. I live in one of the most fucked up countries in the world. It is so bad that if the authorities read this thread, I am going to jail along with being tortured for a very long time because having anything but praise towards the country means you are 'against the government!' which spells your doom. No joke.
Decapitation and stoning are some of the publicly law-enforced punishments here as well.

[D3adcell]

I don't mind any weather or geographical location to live in. I eat anything so I don't care about cuisine choices. I have no religion (guess that makes me an atheist). I am single and have no dependents. I'm in my late 20's with a Masters degree in Education, but I don't care what kind of job I get as long as I can feed my self and live under a roof- which is why Canada's health system is a big plus for me since I may be broke. I could spend the rest of my life washing dishes and I'll still be happy. I just want to get the fuck out of where I am now since I can't take it any longer. I live in one of the most fucked up countries in the world. It is so bad that if the authorities read this thread, I am going to jail along with being tortured for a very long time because having anything but praise towards the country means you are 'against the government!' which spells your doom. No joke.
Decapitation and stoning are some of the law-enforced punishments here as well.

Then I would suggest going to whichever country you can get into faster.

[Romoware]

Canada is pretty sweet if you'd like to have a very safe place to live. And if you like maple syrup, beer, hockey, and Frenchmen.

The United States has opportunity out the ass, though. In places you can access everything except Frenchmen, which I feel could be considered heaven on Earth.

At any rate, get yourself over here. If Canada is easier to get into, then go for it. If you decide to move the the US, you can always do that later.
Not trying to start an argument but if you check Interpols records Canada actually has a higher crime rate than the US. That being said do not move to D.C. or NYC lol

[Romoware]

I don't mind any weather or geographical location to live in. I eat anything so I don't care about cuisine choices. I have no religion (guess that makes me an atheist). I am single and have no dependents. I'm in my late 20's with a Masters degree in Education, but I don't care what kind of job I get as long as I can feed my self and live under a roof- which is why Canada's health system is a big plus for me since I may be broke. I could spend the rest of my life washing dishes and I'll still be happy. I just want to get the fuck out of where I am now since I can't take it any longer. I live in one of the most fucked up countries in the world. It is so bad that if the authorities read this thread, I am going to jail along with being tortured for a very long time because having anything but praise towards the country means you are 'against the government!' which spells your doom. No joke.
Decapitation and stoning are some of the law-enforced punishments here as well.
Sorry man didn't read this post before I posted. Canada and US are great time to get stepping.

[jaxmkii]

Z if you want to live in the US I can hook you up with a Appt in Conneticut for cheap as im a landlord. we have lots of need for teachers in the local area PM me for details.

Conneticut is a good state to get stated in as its very diverse in culture and climate and its easy to make money in this state. (second highest income per cap in the union)

[iSDK]

I'd say come to the US. Wanna know why?

Because Canadian winters suck, and boy do they suck hard.

[Viper]

Florida needs teachers. Too many are of retirement age and not enough young blood to fill the departures.

[Fillibuster]

^Lots of places need teachers from what I understand.

[Negativity]

Canadian winters will make a man out of a 2-year old girl.

[jaxmkii]

^ the only reason our family left cannada... it sucks durring winter.

CT teachers make about 55K annulay and they are hiring. and i have a wicked appt for Z to use untill he gets on his feet and he's welcome to hang as long as he wants.

and this is going to sound pathedic but... i neeed freinds. Torrington is also a awsome small city of 40K surrounded by some of new englands most beutiful forest and country roads. (bikers/auto enthusits dream) NYC, Boston, RI beaches all within a 2 hours drive/train.

[jaxmkii]

Then I would suggest going to whichever country you can get into faster.

no shit... Z i don't know any thing about the immigration prosess but (maybe someone could offer advice) I wonder if you could go to a US embassy and ask for ameisty tell them you have a freind in the states that will sponcor you.(me)

[Omega]

Jamaica.

[Soda Jones]

Since you have a masters in education I say go for the U.S. Getting a job full-time teaching will guarantee state health benefits. Often there are programs that help assist those who are teaching and want to get a doctorate.

[curryking1]

You automatically are eligible for a great pension as a teacher in say Ontario as part of the Ontario Teacher's Pension Plan. The security of investment is the highest of probably most plans anyone in any country rightly deserves...

Teacher's as part of the OTPP own MLSE (pro basketball and pro hockey teams), Maple Leaf Foods, and other things which are basically all massive, growing businesses.

Just don't join the Toronto District School Board (they have some outstanding issues with student enrollment for years now). If you want to be close to a metropolitan hub, best is to be around Toronto in one of the suburbs so you can work for York Region District. That's basically 20 min to an hour drive into Toronto depending on how close you are to the city limits (Toronto city limits, not Greater Toronto Area limits).

Other provinces all have their own systems. And you get all health benefits everyone else gets, plus additional stuff.

Plus you're part of a union, and unions in Canada really means the union is covering your back.

The pay you get in Canada as a teacher is... well it's pretty darn high. As a masters you'll probably be looking for secondary school teaching at the least.

http://www.livingin-canada.com/salaries-for-secondary-school-teachers.html

Those are public wages too. General public service people get a great deal of goodies and pay in Canada. Basically if you're working for a public school, you're pretty much working as a government worker, and government workers always get the most secure and best benefits and for the same work almost always get higher paid than others.

In the global recession education services and pay have not had significant cuts in any province. Definitely not any cuts to salaries. Haven't heard anything about cuts to number of teachers either, probably because it hasn't happened in many years, a few more teachers has never hurt schools here in any way.

Stability of education system here is solid. There's not an epic shortage of teachers--not like there's low pay or anything here for teachers, the high pay means more suitably trained people want these jobs--but the system can always use more.

If Canada is your choice, I recommend moving to Ottawa if you like a laid back and pleasant city, around Toronto if you want access to a metropolitan hub and services which go along with that, or any manner of city in Southern Ontario such as London or Waterloo or whatever, or any city between Toronto and Ottawa. If you want to go to a place with decidedly European flavour, Montreal is a beautiful city, in Quebec and further north though.

All these cities have very close access to water bodies, nice beaches and such, the US/CA border if you ever want to go to New York or something. Go north a bit and you'll have plenty of natural parks and recreation to visit. There's plenty of parks within cities too, Toronto has the Toronto Zoo and whatnot as well. Southwestern Ontario is an extremely versatile area and is quite suitable for all manner of people.

Which gets to the part where Toronto and Ottawa and such are very diverse. High tolerance of all faiths, lots of intermingling between all sorts of people. Tons of grandiose festivals celebrating diversity, like Carribana and the Gay Pride Parade every year, all sorts of great food to eat from anywhere in the world, etc etc etc. There's no real customs or cultural expecations at all in Canada (other than you have to wear clothes don't be rude and such). No one really identifies with Canada except the few Canadians who have had generations of living here, that's probably my favourite thing about Canada, everyone is from everywhere and then some, you get to learn about and mingle with the world really.

(My least favourite thing is how like in any other Western country kids are growing up thinking more and more selfishly and whatnot, but that's a whole other story lol)

I know the least about Vancouver and Western cities, not really gone there often. It's probably the same as the East, just all the way over there. The only thing is they are even more beautiful.

commonwealth, which means we don't require a passport to visit other commonwealth nations.

It's very culturally diverse, you'll see.

Not true. Canada is diverse, but not culturally so. There's a striking difference between muliticultural (something which we have little of) and diversity (something which we have a great deal of).

Also, we're not even really part of the commonwealth. Not only don't Canadians identify with the commonwealth, neither does business or trade between Canada and commonwealth nations operate as it should between commonwealth nations.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/the-old-grey-commonwealth-aint-what-it-used-to-be/article1327311/

We're essentially not even part of the commonwealth... or rather we get few benefits a commonwealth nation should. And that's why we're going to be out soon. Once Queen Elizabeth II dies we will soon officially cut ties to the commonwealth. Realistically, we have no ties right now.

[iSDK]

^ while i'm sure that has a lot of smart sounding words... all i read was


cold, cold, cold, cold, cold, FUCK ITS COLD!!!

[bobo_ess]

Not true. Canada is diverse, but not culturally so. There's a striking difference between muliticultural (something which we have little of) and diversity (something which we have a great deal of).

huh...the french of quebec, we have more 1st nation tribes than i can count, all different in their own way.

Nova scotia has a strong scottish background,as well as acadian, the same goes for the rest6 of the maritimes.

the prairie provinces are predominantly eastern european.

All of the different Immigrants that flock to montreal and toronto, vancouver as well.

Newfoundland is a mix of french, irish and scottish background.

the north is basically indigenous.

Ontario has a strong english background.

New Brunswick is a bilingual province

Manitoba has strong metis ties.

Sounds pretty multicultural to me.

But what would i know, i only trekked across the country with my father, seen every province, the territories are the only places i haven't been to yet.

[Soda Jones]

Either option would be a great choice. Good luck!

[curryking1]

huh...the french of quebec, we have more 1st nation tribes than i can count, all different in their own way.

Nova scotia has a strong scottish background,as well as acadian, the same goes for the rest6 of the maritimes.

the prairie provinces are predominantly eastern european.

All of the different Immigrants that flock to montreal and toronto, vancouver as well.

Newfoundland is a mix of french, irish and scottish background.

the north is basically indigenous.

Ontario has a strong english background.

New Brunswick is a bilingual province

Manitoba has strong metis ties.

Sounds pretty multicultural to me.

But what would i know, i only trekked across the country with my father, seen every province, the territories are the only places i haven't been to yet.

Again, there's a difference between multiculturalism and diversity.

Diversity - many different people in a community, could be from many different places, or different backgrounds, or different whatever

Multiculturalism - many different cultures within a community. Cultures is not defined by where people are from or what religions they have (it is partially, but there's much more to culture than just where people are from or their religion).

Culture is the behaviour of a society or group of people. The only multiculturalism present in Canada involves indigenous people. Multiculturalism is having many different mini-societies with different behaviours and laws and norms within a larger society. This is not the case for almost every developed country, and where it does happen it is to a limited extent.

There is little multiculturalism in Canada. This topic has been brought up and dispelled a few times, most popularly by the G&M recently. Canada is diverse, not multicultural, there is a very, very big difference.

I'm not disputing what you know about all these places, you've traveled much more than I have. Your definitions are confused though.

Different cultures with a community == multiculturalism =/= different people in a community.

[jaxmkii]

to be honest... if i was Z i would be shooting to teach english in the bahamas.

*dreams about packing things in the sail boat and going tropic...*

[Broly]

To make the best of your newly found freedoms in the United States, I suggest avoiding some of the aforementioned places. New York City, Washington, D.C., the state of California... There are a few other places you don't want to be either, but just about anything is better than what you have described. I have no experience with Canada. Its health care is tempting, but I'm admittedly not able to handle the colder climates.

If you're sensitive to colder climates, good luck with the climates in either country. Though I'm pretty sure you lived in the United Kingdom at some point, so that may not be much of a problem. Take the quickest, easiest way out that you can and figure everything else out once you're here. Having friends to help you is an indispensable asset.

[Chris]

Not that I'm advocating that you should move there, but I feel the need to defend my native area, NYC was just recently rated the 8th safest major metropolitan area in the US. Aside from the fact that the area is ridiculously expensive, I love the city, it's my favorite place to be.

[curryking1]

Yeppers, generally the larger cities have smaller per capita crime, or are on the lower end of per capita crime for a given town/city, especially concerning violent crime. They probably won't be the least on the list of per capita crime, but that's only because there are so many different places which could by chance be much safer.

Probably fewer persons per X people commit crimes in larger cities because... maybe there's more people around so it's more difficult to commit crimes, generally better security and police forces, more technology for security, stuff like that. Could be totally other reasons too.

It's generally in smaller towns that there's is more risk of landing in a place where crime per capita is much higher.

Of course there's plenty of places which buck that trend pretty well.

[Soda Jones]

Not that I'm advocating that you should move there, but I feel the need to defend my native area, NYC was just recently rated the 8th safest major metropolitan area in the US. Aside from the fact that the area is ridiculously expensive, I love the city, it's my favorite place to be.

+1

If I had to live on the East Coast it would either be in NYC (specifically Brooklyn) or Boston. Both are magnificent cities and I've never felt threatened or unsafe in either city.

[Bryan]

Not trying to start an argument but if you check Interpols records Canada actually has a higher crime rate than the US. That being said do not move to D.C. or NYC lol

I got lazy and didn't mention that I am more concerned with violent crime, which is lower in Canada. Welcome to E-mpire, by the way.

Z, get out asap.

[bobo_ess]

I'm not disputing what you know about all these places, you've traveled much more than I have. Your definitions are confused though.

yeah...i was battling a head cold that day...good thing i checked up on this today, would have went krazy again if i didn't.

But we do have the highest per capita immigration rate...only because they can't keep up with the 1st nation rate of reproduction ;)

[jaxmkii]

+1

If I had to live on the East Coast it would either be in NYC (specifically Brooklyn) or Boston. Both are magnificent cities and I've never felt threatened or unsafe in either city.

the scientific community in Boston is unmatched in this world.

[=NukeBlaze=]

Not that I'm advocating that you should move there, but I feel the need to defend my native area, NYC was just recently rated the 8th safest major metropolitan area in the US. Aside from the fact that the area is ridiculously expensive, I love the city, it's my favorite place to be.

Majdanek was the safest death camp in WW2.

[Chris]

Majdanek was the safest death camp in WW2.

Really? You feel that is an appropriate analogy?

[GreyKnoll]

Quite. Mir was the safest space station.

[{Delta}]

Oh, be nice you two. Cheap shots indeed. :)

[Chris]

Quite. Mir was the safest space station.

Again, I find myself dumbfounded how one would compare a space station, or a city, to a concentration camp. The former are intended to be safe, the latter, however, was not.

I would've found the Mir analogy to be much more pertinent, despite the fact that it was deliberately de-orbited, and it didn't just fall out of orbit.

[jaxmkii]

Mt Chyenan is the worlds safest nuclear waste disposal sight.

[Viper]

Earth is the solar systems safest planet.

Boston and NYC are both very nice urban cities but the cost of living is very painful....especially during the recession. Try some of the large cities in the south to get a similar urban feel that's not as wallet robbing as the north.

[Media]

Don't let anyone in this thread tell you that New York City isn't the greatest city in the world, because that's simply a lie. However, if you're moving here with no relatives or friends, it wouldn't be the cheapest option to live in Manhattan. Queens, Bronx, and Brooklyn have much more reasonable housing markets as far as I understand.

I'm not very known to encourage people to move here as opposed to smaller countries, but in comparison to Canada, I'd definitely suggest you come here. It's much better, in my comparative opinion.

[Segitz]

Having only read the first post, I can't comment on what the others said, but... I have thought about moving away from Germany myself, when I finish my degree, or soon thereafter.

Canada is also one of the places I consider moving to. It's also healthcare that I think about, but also things like crimerate play into it. I don't want to fear for my safety when I go onto the street. I know, it isn't as bad as television makes it sound in the US, but still, I am taking this into consideration.

Thing is just, I want to live somewhere, where the winters are mild and the summers not too hot (basically a climate like Italy or Spain... I hate the winters here... I hate the cold)

Australia is also a place I consider...

[curryking1]

All major Canadian cities are below the latitude of most of Europe.

It's October 31... temperatures in Southwestern Ontario...

It's still freaking 13 C outside. Toronto, Ottawa, London, Waterloo, everywhere.

Winters are getting much shorter.

Shame the reverse will be happening in Europe hehe, the Gulf Stream will be missed soon.

[iSDK]

Upon further review I suggest either:

Boston, MA or Irvine, CA

Boston gets you the history while Irvine gives you warm

[Viper]

Thing is just, I want to live somewhere, where the winters are mild and the summers not too hot (basically a climate like Italy or Spain... I hate the winters here... I hate the cold)

Atlanta has a very similar climate to Madrid according to climate data on both cities.

However it still snows in both places in the winter so if you want a little warmer than that I suggest Florida.

Jacksonville, Tampa, Orlando, Miami, West Palm Beach, Ft. Lauderdale, St. Petersburg, Cape Coral/Ft. Myers....summers a little hotter than Madrid (+5f/+2c high temperatures) but very nice winters.

[Negativity]

Seasons will blow his mind.

[TrueVCU]

Come to America. We have New York.

Also, as your people are not yet aware of the fact that parity has been reached, shit be cheaper here.

[Segitz]

Atlanta has a very similar climate to Madrid according to climate data on both cities.

However it still snows in both places in the winter so if you want a little warmer than that I suggest Florida.

Jacksonville, Tampa, Orlando, Miami, West Palm Beach, Ft. Lauderdale, St. Petersburg, Cape Coral/Ft. Myers....summers a little hotter than Madrid (+5f/+2c high temperatures) but very nice winters.

My "great" uncle (uncles father on the other side) lives in Fort Lauderdale^^ Should visit him :D

I guess a degree in Computer Science (with my major in CG/Serious Gaming (yes, that REALLY is called like this :P)) I should be able to work anywhere :D

I'd probably go anywhere, where people speak english or german. I have no interest in learning another language (I do speak some spanish and french though).

I've looked into immigration laws of several countries already, and having a degree from a german Uni is a huge plus.


Well, as I said, I hate cold weather, so Canada will be a harder nut to crack :D (when I was in the Bundeswehr, I had the night shift as a guard at -28°C, which was FREAKISHLY cold... hopefully I will never have to do something like that again :D)

[Z]

THis is what I learned about immigration rules; if it'll help you:

Australia:
Live there continuously for two years and you qualify for permanent residency. You have to get 100 points in a long check list then go through an exam. The check list gives you point for age, education level, work experience, etc. It is really easy to score 100 unless you were old (over 45 or 50 years old) and have no proper education. YOu can check the list in the Australian immigration website. The test is about both ENglish and a little about Australia (history and modern info).

New Zealand: I think it is fairly similar to Australians'

US: five years after getting a green card (permanent residency), you can become a citizen. That duration is shortened to 4 years if you work that much or 3 years if you marry a US citizen. I am still trying to find out what you need to get a green card in the first place.

Canada: I was surprise to see it is the easiest country to stay in. You only need to live for one continuous year in the country to qualify for residency. You can be there for ANY reason as long as it is legal (since you need to prove you've been there for that duration). I am not sure, but I think they'll even count the time if you go there illegally but can get a job or study there. I don't know how long till you get citizenship or what are the requirements, but hell if I car. I only need a guarantee that nobody will break into my room in the middle of the night and kick me out of the country all of the sudden.


But I guess you aren't interested in relocating to a different language. Yet still, Canada is one of those countries that allows dual citizenship. That'll make your travels much easier in the future if you plan jumping between countries often.

[curryking1]

Just so people know where Toronto is:

http://i36.tinypic.com/bvudy.jpg

You could imagine that NY and Toronto have the similar weather, and you'd be right. They are basically in the same spot around Lake Ontario. Same with Detroit and Buffalo. Being in New York, Toronto, Buffalo, Detroit are all great cities to be in. You're in the focal point of North America basically. No wonder why, this is about where people settled mainly when they came over from Europe.

Toronto and the surrounding suburban areas, making Greater Toronto, has a population of 5.5 million people (yep, 1/6th of Canada lives here). By contrast Greater Montreal has 3.3 million people, and Vancouver metropolitan has 2.1 million people. In those three cities is 1/3 of Canada's population. That's why I recommend moving to one of those three cities or Ottawa mainly lol.

By comparison, the City of New York alone has around 8.5 million people and is the largest city in the US (second largest is LA with 3.5 million I think), and the State of NY has I think around 18 or 19 million people (State of NY is a much larger area than any of the districts listed above).

From the map you can also see Toronto is actually south of the largest strip of the CA/US border. That strip of land and a good portion of the region above it is Southern Ontario.

This is contrary to popular belief. Canada's population is much less uniformly distributed across our land mass. Most of Canada lives across the strip which makes up the border and not many degrees further up than that. Very few people live far from the southern parts of Canada.

http://i34.tinypic.com/ji25y0.jpg

Zoom out a bit, and we see it's on the same latitude as France and Italy. It's also quite a bit south of the UK and Ireland, however the UK area is warmer because of the Gulf Stream.

For Segitz, it never gets close to -28 C in Southern Ontario lol. You can also see it's south of most of Europe.

P.S. Z you should probably take advantage of the relaxed immigration as well. There are signs that requirements will become more strict soon, but I'm not familiar with this topic enough to say anything else, so take that with a grain of salt.

[Negativity]

Curryking, Canadian cities are culturally diverse, there are vast amounts of distinct subcultures with which one can integrate; however, it is true, there are seven or eight 'main' cultures which are by in large on the same leaf. Someone from Montreal or Vancouver will most definitely not have the same mindset about life as someone from Calgary or the G.T.A.

Toronto is nice, but Montreal and Ottawa are nicer, though Ottawa is relatively mundane. Seeing as I live in Montreal, I can vouch that it is roughly a smaller New York City (which is a wonderful place, by the way, although it has an otiose scent) with a greater French population. It is a fairly liberal city, I'm able to smoke weed openly despite it's illegality, you generally have to be a douche bag to get into heat with authority. We have occasional riots sparked by either victory or loss of our hockey team, but this an uncommon experience. The public transportation system, despite all the flack the locals will give it, is quite stellar and has earned my respect

For the bad: Quebec is the highest taxed province in the country; there is a heavy socialist/union mentality floating around; we're just lazy. It can get pretty damn cold and we get a lot of snow/ice.

Meh, I don't really know what to say... if you come live here, we can go boxing!

[frosty]

By comparison, the City of New York alone has around 8.5 million people and is the largest city in the US (second largest is LA with 3.5 million I think)


Atlanta and dallas (or houston, forgot which) both have 4 million people.

[bobo_ess]

70% of canada lives within 100 miles of the US Border

[bobo_ess]

Toronto is nice, but Montreal and Ottawa are nicer, though Ottawa is relatively mundane.

Vancouver trumps them when it isn't raining...Victoria is gorgeous though. Charlottetown is a cute lil place

[Gummy]

I can't recommend Southern California right now, it's just meh.
Although you can go to Las Vegas, Nevada for really cheap housing, but the weather is not so great.
But you can adapt to it I guess.

Anyways, the really affordable communes in California are usually the out of nowhere area, but they're huge houses, it's just the places isn't always that great and I don't mean like dangerous or anything like that, just kind of far away from the city.


I have no idea what to say about Canada soo.... yeah.

[curryking1]

Atlanta and dallas (or houston, forgot which) both have 4 million people.

Those are metropolitan. Metropolitan areas are not the same as cities, they have very different boundaries.

When I was talking NYC at 8.5 million it was just the city, following up when I talked about LA, it was only the city as well at 3.5 million, the next largest city in the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_population

Curryking, Canadian cities are culturally diverse, there are vast amounts of distinct subcultures with which one can integrate; however, it is true, there are seven or eight 'main' cultures which are by in large on the same leaf. Someone from Montreal or Vancouver will most definitely not have the same mindset about life as someone from Calgary or the G.T.A.

I can agree with this interpretation of the multicultural system.

As you can see these are more political cultures than anything else. Very good observation by the way.

Usually when people say multicultural, they try to associate it with the actual behaviours of the people. The differences between how people behave however and the laws we abide by are very minimal over the whole country. For example, cock fighting might be a part of some cultures in the world, and in Canada we may have people from those cultures. However, people from these places they will still have to abide by the laws in Canada which do not allow cock-fighting. This is an example of not being multicultural. It's a commonly used example lol.

But please don't misunderstand, this is totally difference from tolerance of other kinds like of faith and thoughts on different political issues and such. It's just to illustrate that the accommodation of other parts of culture don't exist in the Western world because the same laws still apply to everyone.

Aside from that... Vancouver, in my opinion, is easily the nicest big city in Canada. I think bobo is probably right that Victoria is even nicer though, I'm sure it is too being on the island... I haven't been there though :'(

And of course PEI and such are beautiful, those areas are just much smaller. I think finding a teaching job there however might actually be even easier. Smaller towns can also often do some special things and bonuses to attract certain types of workers, like doctors or teachers and stuff.

70% of canada lives within 100 miles of the US Border

Yeppers.

[Viper]

Curry, I was going to point out the same thing. The difference between city limits and consolidated metropolitan area.

By city limits, just 9 cities in the US are greater than 1 million. But there are 52 cities with a metro areas over 1 million.

The full NYC metro is 22 million and the full LA metro is 19 million. Toronto's full metro is 6 million.

[Negativity]

And of course PEI and such are beautiful, those areas are just much smaller. I think finding a teaching job there however might actually be even easier. Smaller towns can also often do some special things and bonuses to attract certain types of workers, like doctors or teachers and stuff.

I can't find any age structure demographics, but hearsay has told me that the Maritimes have an aging population, therefore teaching in that corner would be unwise.

Oh, and for the record, I like the East coast more than the West coast. Consider it foolish pride.

[Garfunkel]

We're essentially not even part of the commonwealth... or rather we get few benefits a commonwealth nation should. And that's why we're going to be out soon. Once Queen Elizabeth II dies we will soon officially cut ties to the commonwealth. Realistically, we have no ties right now.

Holly crap. We are ditching her too when that happens.

Anyone else?

Her daughter/son/whatever will will be a very lonely king/queen/whatever.

[Garfunkel]

I would recommend coming to Brisbane in Australia. Or somewhere else on the gold coast. As with most places in Australia. Low crime, high diversity, high cultural diversity, best climate on the planet, seemingly recession proof (only developed economy not to have gone into recession recently), low unemployment (right now it's at 5.7%, the highest it got to during this "downturn" was 5.9%, Great demand for teaching staff. It'll go back down to 3,5 percent or less in the coming year or two. High economic growth. Very low govt debt. (Yes we can actually keep track of spending) Things are getting cheaper because our dollar is so strong right now. Get in right now while house prices are still fairy low. Best beaches in the world, great food. Probably the most stable democracy and economy on the planet. Epic population boom right now. Excellent health care (One of the best in the world, if not the). Not too many religious nut cases in parliament. (There is a few, and unfortunately they hold the balance of power).

If you want cheaper living there is always Tasmania (bit colder, still good climate), You can get a nice house for $80,000 AUD if you look around. (Employment is a bit harder down there).

Sydney is ok, but a bit of a hole.

Just about the only bad things about Australia:

Shitty TV (apart from the public broadcasters like the ABC and the SBS), we get all the rubbish from the US, reality shows and "WOW CELEBRITIES!!!!". I just wish we got the BBC here.
Shitty internet (hopefuly the NBN will fix this with 100mbps for all).
possible Internet filtering (probably won't happen because nobody but the govt supports it).
Stephen Conroy.
Occasionally we have one of those days where Sydney turns into the hottest place on earth (no joke, this happens occasionally).
The Wallabies have completely forgotten how to play footy.
Deadly snakes, deadly spiders, deadly trees, deadly everything.
Bushfires in some places.

[curryking1]

Her daughter/son/whatever will will be a very lonely king/queen/whatever.


Prince Charles is set to succeed Queen Elizabeth I think.

Funnier thing is he's visiting Canada, which would be purposeful if his face was actually going to be printed on our money lol.

But Prince Charles has a good mind. He's very inquisitive, and he is actually a pretty proactive guy. I don't think it would hurt us that much to have some lesser connection after the queen dies.

But I guess the connection isn't really needed.

Canada and Britain have excellent relations anyway. Aside from climate change goals and weird and crappy trade policies, we're pretty chummy :P

[Garfunkel]

Speaking about me saying Sydney gets rather hot on occasion...

It's 39 degrees here now. It seems today is one of those days.

[Viper]

That's 102F. The whole southern half of the US hits those numbers pretty often too. It's not so bad when the humidity is low like the western states making it actually feel cooler but in the southeastern corner you can have heat indexes of 130F.

[Z]

I would assume the answer to my following question is no, but as I was negatively surprised with Australia, I have to ask just in case:

If I live in Canada, compared to the services I get from the US (like TV, entertainment, internet, phone, city infrastructure, public services, etc.) would I feel that far behind?

I lived in Brisbane, Australia for almost two years and it was nice, but did feel I was way behind the curve when it came to the above. There is a lot of progress and building going on everywhere, but right now, you did feel you were living behind of the rest of the developed world. Some of it is what Garfunkel mentioned about internet; they have very expensive internet, very slow and with a ridiculous usage cap. That REALLY got into me since it made me feel grounded most of the time; can't play much online, can't watch much youtube, etc. and to cap it off, they have annual subscription only so not much leeway thee either. Also, the have a water shortage problem which scares the living daylight out of me. According to Wikipedia, the water percentage in the entire country I live in now is 'negligible'! They don't even have a single river, pond or regular rain. It is EXTREMELY dry here and you have to wait for weeks in line to get your share of the water (which comes in one tank you use to fill your underground tank at home.... and it is expensive!
So having water shortages in Australia- while nothing like where I live now- still triggers a psychological condition in me that I rather not go through.

Another thing about Australia is it was expensive. I buy my books used off of the US Amazon (there isn't an Australian Amazon) and they cost me half as much as buying them locally even though I was paying for internationally and priority shipping!

Of course, it is heaven compared to where I live in now, but since there was a small opportunity for me to relocate to NA, I took that chance. I figured I can always go back if all fails. Maybe I can go to New Zealand if that happens since it is a natural gorgeous piece of heaven of a country there. It is so beautiful that you won't care about anything else. :) Hey, if all else fails, its better than nothing- that or I do what I should've done 10 years ago...

[Hisham]

Our telecommunications industry is in need to restructuring because it is essentially an Oligopoly but in terms of speeds of the Internet and whatnot, then we are on the same level as the US (at least in the Toronto area). Currently you can get decent high speed cable (10mbps down/512kbps up) for about 50 bucks a month with a cap of 60gb. And if you don't care about spending a lot of money on the internet, you can even get a 50mbps down/2mbps up connection with a 175gb cap for about 150 bucks a month. And monthly caps don't cut off your net when you go over them, they just charge you extra usage costs for a maximum of 25 dollars. And this is just the big company, there are tons of smaller companies offering similar services and some of them don't have bandwidth caps either. So you can do your research and see.

TV wise, we also get everything, but the way that the cable industry is set up, a lot of the streaming websites like Hulu aren't available in Canada yet (but hotspot shield takes care of that pretty much). The one thing is that the Canadian PSN store isn't as flexible as the US PSN store in terms of the video store (seeing as we don't have one). Again this is because of our shitty Telecommunications industry. All the US content that we get is usually filtered through Canadian channels which means they have the distribution rights in Canada. Meaning that they can't get them out on the streaming/download services that the US PSN and US Netflix offers. That isn't a big deal tho because we do get every show that the US gets on TV and DVD. And if you ever miss a show on TV there is always the option to download it and watch it the next day with BitTorrent. I expect this to change soon tho. Seriously though, within the next couple of years, this should also be a non-issue. We are always integrating with US business models and such so we will probably end up with these things in the not to distant future.

City infrastructure and public services are pretty much the same as the US if you live around the bigger cities. I mean Toronto has suburbs all around it. Cities on the outskirts of Toronto such as Mississauga, and Brampton are also very good places to live with very cheap and affordable housing in certain areas of those cities (Sidenote: I live in Mississauga. Love it here).

Can't comment on phones because I don't know shit. All I have is a cell phone that can make calls when I need too and that is all I need for it. I'm on a family plan too so that is another reason why I can't really comment. I mean we do have all the latest blackberries and phones here as well. I mean we aren't as good as England or Japan in the phone respect, but neither is the US so it would be pretty much the same.

Anyways, I highly suggest you take into account the job market as well. Where did you get your masters from? Because US, Canada and most of the western world don't take into account 3rd world country degrees. As bad as it may sound, that is the truth for a lot of people immigrating from the East to the West.

[Garfunkel]

That's 102F. The whole southern half of the US hits those numbers pretty often too. It's not so bad when the humidity is low like the western states making it actually feel cooler but in the southeastern corner you can have heat indexes of 130F.

It gets to 48 degrees here on the worst of days. If you go out west into broken hill or so it gets worse. We also have those sorts of days not too far out from winter. Now place stage 3 water restrictions on top of that for most of the population.

Earlier this year when top gear was touring, we saw their show when it was 46 or something. Coming from the UK they were sweating like pigs.

As for NZ. I found Auckland kinda bummy but that was just me. And because they literally have no rail network it's not rare to see 30,000KG trucks ramming down narrow mountain roads at 120kms. Fucking suicidal. Other than that, very lovely place once you get out into the country.

and their accents piss me off.

[Z]

Where did you get your masters from?
I got that covered; I got it from Australia- unless that too wouldn't be accepted... >_<
It's from Queensland University; one of the most prestigious unis in the country- or so I was told.



their accents piss me off.
I only really noticed it after watching Flight of the Conchords. lol

[bobo_ess]

I can't find any age structure demographics, but hearsay has told me that the Maritimes have an aging population, therefore teaching in that corner would be unwise.

Oh, and for the record, I like the East coast more than the West coast. Consider it foolish pride.

Most of the working adults usually go out west in search for work.

[Z]

70% of canada lives within 100 miles of the US Border

In my research I found out that 3/4 of Canadians live within 200km from the US border. I was surprised to learn that, but it does make sense when you think about it.

[Garfunkel]

I imagine up north would get pretty darn cold.

[bobo_ess]

Yup, the continental climate in some regions make the temperature pretty extreme in some places, like northern Saskatchewan and alberta.

The Gulf Stream keeps things pretty moderate for The Maritimes. You can get alot of snow in the winters in certain places.

[Garfunkel]

Yeah, that makes sense. Same story here in Australia. Most of the country is unlivable desert, the rest is beautiful coastline. So like 2/3rd of people or something (or is it 80%?) life in cities, all the main ones of which are pretty much on the coast.

With the el nino and la nina effects or whatever they are called being confused and not going the right way lately due to climate change, the climate and rainfall is horrendously harsh in the red centre. So nobody but the occasional roadtrain and small regional communities live there.

Now can you imagine laying fibre optic cable over that land? Or a commercial entity doing so?

[Viper]

America is one of the few countries to have both tundra and tropical locations. Granted both are not part of the continental body but we do get close with Minnesota in the north and Florida in the south.

[Z]

But the good thing about the US is that it has more 'livable' areas than say Australia or Canada.

PS. did you know that even with all the people living in the US, it is about 94% empty? I just found that an amusing fact a few years ago. :)

[GameWaver]

I live in the northwest of USA, and it's pretty much same weather as London. But you can find any type. My personal recommendation would be to move to Vancouver BC. It's one of the most expensive places to live, but it is also my favorite city. If you can handle constant rain, it's a blast.