Halo 2 "Hype"

[Michael Bluth]

All I've been seeing from you Nintendo boys is that Halo 2 is a game that people like and buy based on hype. But what hype did Microsoft create? Besides ilovebess.com for the hardcore fans, what did they do out of the ordinary? They have TV commercials and movie ads.... so do Nintendo. If anything, they have been doing LESS. They rarely released screen shots or let information get out about the game until the two weeks leading up to its release, even after the game was leaked.

So please, go ahead and tell me.

[[[tavis]]]

the hype was from bungie, M$ didn't make the game.

and alot of websites that were always updating and talking about its possibilities

[Michael Bluth]

Bungie had a weekly update, something typical for a developer that's so in-touch with its fans. They didn't release much information, nor screens.

[Mach]

All I've been seeing from you Nintendo boys is that Halo 2 is a game that people like and buy based on hype. But what hype did Microsoft create? Besides ilovebess.com for the hardcore fans, what did they do out of the ordinary? They have TV commercials and movie ads.... so do Nintendo. If anything, they have been doing LESS. They rarely released screen shots or let information get out about the game until the two weeks leading up to its release, even after the game was leaked.

So please, go ahead and tell me.
LOL, you gotta be kidding me if you haven't recognized it.

The media is what has given MS a free ride. Pop culture/Hollywood support also helps kids think it's cool. Other than that like I said it's the media. G4techTV, MTV, every magazine in the country, every multi-console site, etc has been hyping and plugging and doing feature stories with absolutely no hint of doubt or negativity for many, many months now.
MS has been working with these press kids by buttering up to them by hooking them up with all the works. The MS ads themselves are just the icing on the cake.

Then again the hype could also be factored in because of the fact that this is essentially the 2nd true crown jewel for the Xbox. Give the gamers your first at the beginning and make em sit out years waiting for a new one. Great strategy.

[orcus116]

I don't know if they really counts as hype but usually devoted fans (tons for Halo in this case) might see plans for a sequel and cream their pants. Then they proceed to tell people how this game will revolutionize and quite possibly create some form of hype for it by getting people interested.

[GleefulFarewell]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v471/Squallsoft/halopwnedcopy.jpg

[Michael Bluth]

LOL, you gotta be kidding me if you haven't recognized it.

The media is what has given MS a free ride. Pop culture/Hollywood support also helps kids think it's cool. Other than that like I said it's the media. G4techTV, MTV, every magazine in the country, every multi-console site, etc has been hyping and plugging and doing feature stories with absolutely no hint of doubt or negativity for many, many months now.
MS has been working with these press kids by buttering up to them by hooking them up with all the works. The MS ads themselves are just the icing on the cake.

Then again the hype could also be factored in because of the fact that this is essentially the 2nd true crown jewel for the Xbox. Give the gamers your first at the beginning and make em sit out years waiting for a new one. Great strategy.

Wait. So it's wrong for people from bands and actors to enjoy the game, but it's write to have John Woo involved in a movie adaptation? Yeah, that makes tons of sense.

G4TechTV... you mean the station that is based around video games actually has information on video games? That's INSANE!!!$ I can't comment further, as I don't even get the channel.

The press kits.... do you mean the ones that tell websites what they CAN NOT talk about? Yeah, that makes tons of sense.

And at least the Xbox has a crown jewel. :)

[HylianKWG]

Wait. So it's wrong for people from bands and actors to enjoy the game, but it's write to have John Woo involved in a movie adaptation? Yeah, that makes tons of sense.


Adam it is RIGHT not WRITE.

[orcus116]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v471/Squallsoft/halopwnedcopy.jpg


I take it you've probably never played the game/are jealous cause it's not being release on GC or something. As much as I'm playing the devil's advocate here after at least playing Halo 2 I won't deny that it is a seriously kick ass game. Take your bashing elsewhere, we're trying to have a discussion.

[Michael Bluth]

Adam it is RIGHT not WRITE.

And it's "Don't blame me, I voted for Kerry!". So what's your point?

[GleefulFarewell]

I take it you've probably never played the game/are jealous cause it's not being release on GC or something. As much as I'm playing the devil's advocate here after at least playing Halo 2 I won't deny that it is a seriously kick ass game. Take your bashing elsewhere, we're trying to have a discussion.

actually i think Halo is one of the koolest/best games ive EVER played...i just thought that was funny...so i posted it...

[HylianKWG]

And it's "Don't blame me, I voted for Kerry!". So what's your point?

Ummm that is what I have dumbass.

[orcus116]

^ actually i think Halo is one of the koolest/best games ive EVER played...i just thought that was funny...so i posted it...

Er...yeah that's exactly the impression I DIDN'T get. If you're trying to say that it's funny don't just post JUST the pic because that seems like 100% grade A bashing.

[Lord Worm]

Halo 2 has a serious problem with its cinematics. First, you see everyone without any details on the character model and nothing in the background, then the details and the background just appears.

How about spending some money so the game doesn't look like cock? AND HOW ABOUT MAKING IT FUCKING SIMPLER TO JOIN A LIVE GAME? Oh, Halo 2 is Live now. That'd be fucking great if I could join a goddamned game. And there's too many damned arrows and icons on the screen when you're playing.

[Michael Bluth]

Ummm that is what I have dumbass.

Notice the capitalization, you fucking goth reject.



And Worm, I totally agree. That was my biggest gripe in one of the previous threads.

[HylianKWG]

LOL that is how I wanted it, you just flat out used the wrong word. And so what gives you the idea that I am a goth, give me a reason why you would think that.

[Michael Bluth]

You're an attention whore, ignorant and a douche.

[HylianKWG]

LOL Oh yeah I just try to get all the attention I can get on here don't I? Are those the only things you could come up with? No valid reasons as to why you think of me as a goth, just insults?

[Bloodman]

You're an attention whore, ignorant and a douche.

And as Bowser once said

"One time, at BANNED camp!"

[Mach]

Wait. So it's wrong for people from bands and actors to enjoy the game, but it's write to have John Woo involved in a movie adaptation? Yeah, that makes tons of sense.

G4TechTV... you mean the station that is based around video games actually has information on video games? That's INSANE!!!$ I can't comment further, as I don't even get the channel.

The press kits.... do you mean the ones that tell websites what they CAN NOT talk about? Yeah, that makes tons of sense.

And at least the Xbox has a crown jewel. :)
Adam, my child. Please don't step into the ring if you're not going to come in with the facts. Let me break this down for ya.
It's not wrong for bands and actors to enjoy a game. I don't think I actually said anything was wrong with all the hype. What I did say is that Hollywood and the entertainment industry has been endorsing all the time every time video gaming is brought up. That helps get the word out.

Secondly, G4TechTV. Yes the same channel that has been providing biased, 100% positive coverage and hype for the game for many months now. They even have a Halo 2 day to celebrate. Did a Nintendo game ever get that? Don't think so.

Press kits? No. I'm talking about the deals MS strikes with different mags to give them special demos, play tests, in exchange for certain totally positive plugs. EGM and other magazines have been doing feature story length articles for like 6 months straight now. I'm for the love of all that is good and decent, all these mainstream magazines have shown their true Halo fanboy colors with all this. Nonstop push and nonstop positivity. Mainstream gamers and Ethiopian-like starving Xbox owners ate it up. So did all the little kiddies and teeny boppers that have this major inferiority complex and feelings of inadequate peer acceptance. Way to go Halo!

Online side of things is no different. If you went on the major sites all you saw was nonstop Halo related features plastered all throughout the website. Saw some Halo features included even in the GameCube section of one site.

Every magazine and website have been giving straight 10's for Halo 2 while all but ignoring Metroid Prime 2 and other awesome games. When they don't ignore Prime 2, they're nitpicking and bitching about every damn little thing they can whine about. Take EGM for example which cited it's major complaint was that Prime 2's levels were convoluted. LOL, that's the point of the game! Halo 2 is an excellent game too. But it had it's large share of flaws just like Prime 2 did but you wouldn't find them in the mainstream press. Nope they were too busy gloating like little fanboys to even mention any flaws or deduct any points because of them. Now we're hearing from all kinds of gamers that are saying they feel disappointed even after they were expecting less than what the hype was saying. Not too good.


But I'm happy for ya buddy. Ya finally got your second decent jewel for Xbox. Took em what? 3 years? But they gave it to ya. Too bad the GameCube has had a nice collection of jewels for years now.

[Michael Bluth]

Adam, my child. Please don't step into the ring if you're not going to come in with the facts. Let me break this down for ya.
It's not wrong for bands and actors to enjoy a game. I don't think I actually said anything was wrong with all the hype. What I did say is that Hollywood and the entertainment industry has been endorsing all the time every time video gaming is brought up. That helps get the word out.

Oh I get it. They aren't allowed the have opinions. Now it makes sense.

Secondly, G4TechTV. Yes the same channel that has been providing biased, 100% positive coverage and hype for the game for many months now. They even have a Halo 2 day to celebrate. Did a Nintendo game ever get that? Don't think so.

Biased? In what way? A Nintendo game would've gotten that coverage if the channel were around in the NES/SNES days.... now no games are worth that kind of coverage. Should Halo 2 get 20 hours of coverage in one day? Nope. Do I care? Nope, like I said, I don't even get the channel.

Press kits? No. I'm talking about the deals MS strikes with different mags to give them special demos, play tests, in exchange for certain totally positive plugs. EGM and other magazines have been doing feature story length articles for like 6 months straight now. I'm for the love of all that is good and decent, all these mainstream magazines have shown their true Halo fanboy colors with all this. Nonstop push and nonstop positivity. Mainstream gamers and Ethiopian-like starving Xbox owners ate it up. So did all the little kiddies and teeny boppers that have this major inferiority complex and feelings of inadequate peer acceptance. Way to go Halo!

So Halo 2 is not allowed to have cover stories or features, but other games are? Sounds incredibly biased to me. It'd be ignorant to think that the sequel to a Game of the Year would get absolutely no coverage in press. Nonstop push and nonstop positivity.... I wonder if that's because it's a good game? After 41 reviews, Halo 2 has an average score of 9.7. If that doesn't say something, I don't know what does.

Online side of things is no different. If you went on the major sites all you saw was nonstop Halo related features plastered all throughout the website. Saw some Halo features included even in the GameCube section of one site.

And that is directly Bungie/Microsoft's fault...... how? Especially on the GameCube website. Did Microsoft contact this GameCube site and ask them to make a feature on their game that will never grace their system of choice?

Every magazine and website have been giving straight 10's for Halo 2 while all but ignoring Metroid Prime 2 and other awesome games. When they don't ignore Prime 2, they're nitpicking and bitching about every damn little thing they can whine about. Take EGM for example which cited it's major complaint was that Prime 2's levels were convoluted. LOL, that's the point of the game! Halo 2 is an excellent game too. But it had it's large share of flaws just like Prime 2 did but you wouldn't find them in the mainstream press. Nope they were too busy gloating like little fanboys to even mention any flaws or deduct any points because of them. Now we're hearing from all kinds of gamers that are saying they feel disappointed even after they were expecting less than what the hype was saying. Not too good.

Tell me, what are the flaws of Halo 2? Have you ever even played the game? Have you ever played the original?

But I'm happy for ya buddy. Ya finally got your second decent jewel for Xbox. Took em what? 3 years? But they gave it to ya. Too bad the GameCube has had a nice collection of jewels for years now.

So many jewels it almost hurt me when I traded my GameCube for DVDs..... almost....

[Mach]

Oh I get it. They aren't allowed the have opinions. Now it makes sense.



Biased? In what way? A Nintendo game would've gotten that coverage if the channel were around in the NES/SNES days.... now no games are worth that kind of coverage. Should Halo 2 get 20 hours of coverage in one day? Nope. Do I care? Nope, like I said, I don't even get the channel.



So Halo 2 is not allowed to have cover stories or features, but other games are? Sounds incredibly biased to me. It'd be ignorant to think that the sequel to a Game of the Year would get absolutely no coverage in press. Nonstop push and nonstop positivity.... I wonder if that's because it's a good game? After 41 reviews, Halo 2 has an average score of 9.7. If that doesn't say something, I don't know what does.



And that is directly Bungie/Microsoft's fault...... how? Especially on the GameCube website. Did Microsoft contact this GameCube site and ask them to make a feature on their game that will never grace their system of choice?



Tell me, what are the flaws of Halo 2? Have you ever even played the game? Have you ever played the original?



So many jewels it almost hurt me when I traded my GameCube for DVDs..... almost....
"Oh I get it. They aren't allowed the have opinions. Now it makes sense."
Again, did I say it was wrong? I believe you asked what were some of the causes of the hype machine. I answered.

"Biased? In what way? A Nintendo game would've gotten that coverage if the channel were around in the NES/SNES days.... now no games are worth that kind of coverage. Should Halo 2 get 20 hours of coverage in one day? Nope. Do I care? Nope, like I said, I don't even get the channel."
So because Nintendo isn't number 1 like before it can't have special coverage for it's excellent games that are released on the GameCube? That's funny seeing as Xbox isn't number 1 either.

"So Halo 2 is not allowed to have cover stories or features, but other games are? Sounds incredibly biased to me. It'd be ignorant to think that the sequel to a Game of the Year would get absolutely no coverage in press. Nonstop push and nonstop positivity.... I wonder if that's because it's a good game? After 41 reviews, Halo 2 has an average score of 9.7. If that doesn't say something, I don't know what does."
No one said it wasn't allowed to have feature stories in magazines. But feature stories for all games have always been usually one time. Not every month for the past 8 months or so in virtually every magazine. Nonstop push and positivity? Yes, it is indeed odd that that would be so seeing as it came months and months before the game was released and fully played through. No positivity was backed by a good review for all those months. It was simple gloating and revelry in a press that clearly saw that there were some issues it could mention that could be seen as problems or down sides (like they do with every other game they preview and write about), but simply chose not to. And seeing as we're talking about the same press, the review average is not surprising. The press adores the Xbox and it has shown to be true fanboys. It nitpicks Prime 2 for being difficult and "convoluted" (whole point of that game) but it mentions nothing bad about Halo 2. Absolutely ridiculous. If you can't see the bias then you're simply blinded from the truth.


"Tell me, what are the flaws of Halo 2? Have you ever even played the game? Have you ever played the original?"
I haven't played Halo 2. I played Halo 1 and like I said before, I was sickened. I enjoyed it for a little bit but the ordeal quickly turned sour right around the part where I got bored of killing techni-colored reject ETs. I also got motion sickness from the beast. But I do know it was considered a great game by a lot of people. Im proud for them. It's good to have a game to call your own for 3 years as you wait for it's sequel. As for Halo 2, like I said, I haven't played it, but I've been keeping note of the disappointments starting to arise from many of the fans around the Internet. Go look at Nukeblaze's thread for a quick example. In fact, I just got off the phone with an old friend of mine. I brought up the subject of Halo 2 (because he's a big Xbox fan), and he told me right off the bat that he's disappointed. And I said, "Why? Did it not live up to the extreme hype?" And he said, it's not that because he didn't buy into the hype. He simply played the game with an open mind expecting it to meet Halo 1 standards and was trully disappointed.


And Adam your definition of jewels is a bit off seeing as you're the same person that rated the Tony Hawk series over the Legend of Zelda. So it's understandable.

[Blaksmoke]

Who the fuck cares about Halo and Zelda and Tony Hawk? WH can't they just make a Skies of Arcadia sequel?

[Prince]

Popular games get more coverage then niche games. After all, magazines wouldn't sell if they wrote about things that nobody cared about. Use common sense.

G4TechTV also had a GTA day. If a Nintendo game were as popular as Halo 2 or San Andreas, I'm sure it would have it's own day of coverage devoted to it too.

[Mach]

Popular games get more coverage then niche games. After all, magazines wouldn't sell if they wrote about things that nobody cared about. Use common sense.

G4TechTV also had a GTA day. If a Nintendo game were as popular as Halo 2 or San Andreas, I'm sure it would have it's own day of coverage devoted to it too.
"Popular games get more coverage then niche games. After all, magazines wouldn't sell if they wrote about things that nobody cared about. Use common sense."
GameCube has had many popular games as well but none of them have got the nonstop, 100% positive press feature story blitz for like 8 months or so straight before their release. Also, you made a very good point. Money. However that does not excuse the biases that go on.

I'm aware of G4's GTA day. It was because of it's mainstream catering just like Halo 2. Smash Bros Melee, Wind Waker, Mario Kart Double Dash, etc have all been on roughly the same popularity level as SA and Halo. Didn't see any days for them.

[Blaksmoke]

Smash Bros. possibly, but Mario Kart and Wind Waker? Definetley not. Melee is still GameCube's most popular game, which is a shame.

[Mach]

Smash Bros. possibly, but Mario Kart and Wind Waker? Definetley not. Melee is still GameCube's most popular game, which is a shame.
Another good point. But you have to look at them in context. We're talking G4TechTV prelaunch coverage. The popularity of a game can only be measured by the projected desire and preordering for the game. Wind Waker had a great deal of popularity seeing as it broke the records for the biggest preorder campaign in history. Seems like that'd be good enough to merit a Wind Waker day. Especially when you consider the magnititude the Legend of Zelda series' impact has had on the industry. But I didn't see one.
As for Mario Kart. It had a ton of anticipation as well. A massive preorder campaign bolstered sales and remember it went largely unanswered by PS2 and Xbox rival games. No reason G4TECHTV couldn't have given it a day of it's own.

But again, G4TechTV is but a small part in the press blitz that bolstered Halo 2 hype.

[HylianKWG]

Mach you might as well give up because Adam's head is as hard as a brick wall and no matter if he is proved wrong or whatever he will still argue with you.

[Mach]

Mach you might as well give up because Adam's head is as hard as a brick wall and no matter if he is proved wrong or whatever he will still argue with you.
I guess that means I'm just the right man for the job!

[HylianKWG]

Hehe Yeah it is fun to see though.

[Prince]

GameCube has had many popular games as well but none of them have got the nonstop, 100% positive press feature story blitz for like 8 months or so straight before their release. Also, you made a very good point. Money. However that does not excuse the biases that go on.

What are they supposed to write about? Nintendo is very secretive about their games and gives very little information to the press.

Other games get more coverage because they release more information. Bungie has had Halo 2 playable at many events, they did weekly updates on the games progress, released new screenshots, etc. The same with San Andreas. Rockstar gave magazines and websites a lot of information, hands on playtime, interviews, screenshots, etc.

I'm aware of G4's GTA day. It was because of it's mainstream catering just like Halo 2. Smash Bros Melee, Wind Waker, Mario Kart Double Dash, etc have all been on roughly the same popularity level as SA and Halo. Didn't see any days for them.

They are not on the same level of popularity. Halo 2 has outsold WW and MKDD in the first 24 hours, and almost reached SSBM's 3 years of sales in the first day on sale. San Andreas is pretty much in the same position.

[Mach]

What are they supposed to write about? Nintendo is very secretive about their games and gives very little information to the press.

Other games get more coverage because they release more information. Bungie has had Halo 2 playable at many events, they did weekly updates on the games progress, released new screenshots, etc. The same with San Andreas. Rockstar gave magazines and websites a lot of information, hands on playtime, interviews, screenshots, etc.



They are not on the same level of popularity. Halo 2 has outsold WW and MKDD in the first 24 hours, and almost reached SSBM's 3 years of sales in the first day on sale. San Andreas is pretty much in the same position.

"What are they supposed to write about? Nintendo is very secretive about their games and gives very little information to the press.

Other games get more coverage because they release more information. Bungie has had Halo 2 playable at many events, they did weekly updates on the games progress, released new screenshots, etc. The same with San Andreas. Rockstar gave magazines and websites a lot of information, hands on playtime, interviews, screenshots, etc."
That ties in somewhat with what I've been saying. Nintendo has always been pretty secretive about its games. The press has always had a grudge against Nintendo for this and their unwillingness to suck up to the press and treat them like royalty. But on a broader level it goes back to the fact the mainstream press generally does not like the idea of a family friendly console that shuns the hip pop culture fused titles seen on other consoles.

And remember this thread was about the causes of the hype. I'm simply answering them.

"They are not on the same level of popularity. Halo 2 has outsold WW and MKDD in the first 24 hours, and almost reached SSBM's 3 years of sales in the first day on sale. San Andreas is pretty much in the same position."
Hmm, you must've missed my post following that. Here it is for ya:
But you have to look at them in context. We're talking G4TechTV prelaunch coverage. The popularity of a game can only be measured by the projected desire and preordering for the game. Wind Waker had a great deal of popularity seeing as it broke the records for the biggest preorder campaign in history. Seems like that'd be good enough to merit a Wind Waker day. Especially when you consider the magnititude the Legend of Zelda series' impact has had on the industry. But I didn't see one.
As for Mario Kart. It had a ton of anticipation as well. A massive preorder campaign bolstered sales and remember it went largely unanswered by PS2 and Xbox rival games. No reason G4TECHTV couldn't have given it a day of it's own.

But again, G4TechTV is but a small part in the press blitz that bolstered Halo 2 hype.

[Lord Worm]

On a plus note for Halo 2, multiplayer is fucking boss when you manage to join a game. It's crazy: You're driving a warthog and somebody hits it with a grendade and the thing spins around and lands on someone else. You can pick up two weapons at once, you can snipe people from far away (They've got a map called Coagulation which is almost exactly the same as blood gultch...Good thinking, too).

They kinda nerfed collision damage with vehicles, though. It was kinda fun to go bowling with a Ghost and go on a killing spree, but now you have to literally crush someone into a rock, back up and crush tem a couple more times to get the job done.

Vehicles do break apart when crashed into another, though, a neat feature.

[Sandman]

I might have bought Halo 2 due to hype, but that doesn't mean it's not the goddamned best game ever.

The hype wasn't created by M$ or Bungie, it was created by the fans.

[Mach]

I might have bought Halo 2 due to hype, but that doesn't mean it's not the goddamned best game ever.

The hype wasn't created by M$ or Bungie, it was created by the fans.

All hype can essentially be traced back to the company making the product because they control what is revealed, to who, and how. But the press, pop culture world, wait, underground fan campaigns, and of course MS's own marketing division are all responsible for the hype.

[HereticPB]

Did this turn into a flame war or what.

That is the casual gamers way. Infest, Infect, Kill and move on to something else. In every industry there are casuals people and hardcore people. The hardcore people know what the deal is and the casuals are brain dead sheep following what the media tells them. Baaaaaaaah. Casuals usually over run something killing off the hardcores smart, intelligent, stuff then the industry dies cause casual shit is lame and over rated. Then the casuals move on to kill another industry.

Have you wondered why the Music or Movie industry is doing badly? Well the Movie industry is improving but the casuals moved into the movie or music fan territory. Some new movies or bands appear and they totally suck but the casuals are ohhh I like them cause there new, shiny, and the media talks about them all the time.

[Michael Bluth]

Again, did I say it was wrong? I believe you asked what were some of the causes of the hype machine. I answered.

Oh, so because a few celebrities play Halo on the road or enjoy the game, it's automatically a part of the "hype machine". Looks like the GBA is a HUGE hype machine with all the people playing them on the go.

So because Nintendo isn't number 1 like before it can't have special coverage for it's excellent games that are released on the GameCube? That's funny seeing as Xbox isn't number 1 either.

Do you even read magazines? There are large cover stories for all games, I'm pretty sure GamePro just had a decent RE4 one. Halo 2 is a game worthy of the coverage, just as the magazines covered GTA: SA as much as they could.

No one said it wasn't allowed to have feature stories in magazines. But feature stories for all games have always been usually one time. Not every month for the past 8 months or so in virtually every magazine. Nonstop push and positivity? Yes, it is indeed odd that that would be so seeing as it came months and months before the game was released and fully played through. No positivity was backed by a good review for all those months. It was simple gloating and revelry in a press that clearly saw that there were some issues it could mention that could be seen as problems or down sides (like they do with every other game they preview and write about), but simply chose not to. And seeing as we're talking about the same press, the review average is not surprising. The press adores the Xbox and it has shown to be true fanboys. It nitpicks Prime 2 for being difficult and "convoluted" (whole point of that game) but it mentions nothing bad about Halo 2. Absolutely ridiculous. If you can't see the bias then you're simply blinded from the truth.

Those positive features came from, you know, hands-on time with the game. Especially multiplayer, Microsoft let companies play the game's multiplayer a lot sooner than they could play the single-player. Oh-0no!1!1 t3h magazines lik3d teh multiplayer and it si prov3n 2 b good wiht all teh reviews!!!1111!!11 Tell me, what issues could have been mentioned? So far.... pop-up graphics in cut scenes. That's. About. It. Oh yeah we all know that Microsoft certainly paid-off every single reviewer out there, and took their families on trips to Cancun so that they would give Halo 2 a good score. Microsoft also paid for all of their kids to go to private school, a new vehicle, paid off their houses and any credit card debt. I don't see bias.... I see the press liking a better game: Halo 2.

I haven't played Halo 2. I played Halo 1 and like I said before, I was sickened. I enjoyed it for a little bit but the ordeal quickly turned sour right around the part where I got bored of killing techni-colored reject ETs. I also got motion sickness from the beast. But I do know it was considered a great game by a lot of people. Im proud for them. It's good to have a game to call your own for 3 years as you wait for it's sequel. As for Halo 2, like I said, I haven't played it, but I've been keeping note of the disappointments starting to arise from many of the fans around the Internet. Go look at Nukeblaze's thread for a quick example. In fact, I just got off the phone with an old friend of mine. I brought up the subject of Halo 2 (because he's a big Xbox fan), and he told me right off the bat that he's disappointed. And I said, "Why? Did it not live up to the extreme hype?" And he said, it's not that because he didn't buy into the hype. He simply played the game with an open mind expecting it to meet Halo 1 standards and was trully disappointed.

So tell me, what are the disappointements? HOLY SHIT, THE CUTSCENE GRAPHICS POP-UP. I wonder how much Blockbuster will give me in trade-in credit for it. The things Nukeblaze mentioned are all items that take getting used to in FPS games. The control was tweaked and so were other areas of the game - once the game is played for a little while, he should have everything down pat. I know I'm starting to.

And Adam your definition of jewels is a bit off seeing as you're the same person that rated the Tony Hawk series over the Legend of Zelda. So it's understandable.

Yeah, you know what The Wind Waker was worth to me? A Rush Hour 2 DVD and two Staind CDs. Just ask CJ, that's what I traded my copy of the game to him for. Tony Hawk is so much more fun it's insane.

-------------------------

Another good point. But you have to look at them in context. We're talking G4TechTV prelaunch coverage. The popularity of a game can only be measured by the projected desire and preordering for the game.

You know what? "G4TechTV" wasn't even around as a single channel when all those Nintendo games were released, so really, you don't have a point - at all. And you also have to realize, TV stations need to advertise, they need to make money. A bunch of shows on Zelda are not going to bring viewers in and make money. The game has it's Nintendo fanboy cult-like followers, and nothing else. Halo 2 and GTA: SA have the ability to reach all video game players, due to the simple fact that both are fun, good games that are very easy to pick-up and play. Zelda.... nah.

Wind Waker had a great deal of popularity seeing as it broke the records for the biggest preorder campaign in history. Seems like that'd be good enough to merit a Wind Waker day. Especially when you consider the magnititude the Legend of Zelda series' impact has had on the industry. But I didn't see one.

The ONLY reason it had so many preorders was because Nintendo gave away a disc full of old Zelda games. I know it, you know it, Nintendo knows it. No other reason. And so much for that preorder record...

As for Mario Kart. It had a ton of anticipation as well. A massive preorder campaign bolstered sales and remember it went largely unanswered by PS2 and Xbox rival games. No reason G4TECHTV couldn't have given it a day of it's own.

Get again, no G4TechTV around. And ontop of that, the advertising point I made. Mario Kart may be a pretty good game, but it is not up there with GTA: SA, Halo 2 or Half-Life 2. Once again, I know it, you know it and Nintendo knows it.

But again, G4TechTV is but a small part in the press blitz that bolstered Halo 2 hype.

If byt "bolstered Halo 2 hype" you really mean "showed viewers how kick-ass of a game it is", then yes, yes they did.

-------------------------

I'm aware of G4's GTA day. It was because of it's mainstream catering just like Halo 2. Smash Bros Melee, Wind Waker, Mario Kart Double Dash, etc have all been on roughly the same popularity level as SA and Halo. Didn't see any days for them.

Oh yeah, the fanbase and longetivity of the games really shows that. The only game people still talk about is SSB: M. It seems as though the other two have fallen off the face of the planet, especially Mario Kart: DD.

-------------------------

Other games get more coverage because they release more information. Bungie has had Halo 2 playable at many events, they did weekly updates on the games progress, released new screenshots, etc. The same with San Andreas. Rockstar gave magazines and websites a lot of information, hands on playtime, interviews, screenshots, etc."
That ties in somewhat with what I've been saying. Nintendo has always been pretty secretive about its games. The press has always had a grudge against Nintendo for this and their unwillingness to suck up to the press and treat them like royalty. But on a broader level it goes back to the fact the mainstream press generally does not like the idea of a family friendly console that shuns the hip pop culture fused titles seen on other consoles.

Bungie released quite a bit less information than normal developers. They did, however, allow the press to enjoy mutliplayer quite a bit. Not many screen shots were released. So the press is given information, but they're not supposed to publish it now? They should have equal coverage of all three systems? Well I hate to break it to you, but the GameCube has only a fraction of the games that the PS2 and Xbox have. There is no much for the press to even publish about the GameCube, let alone exclusive games at the level of GTA: SA, Halo 2, Ratchet & Clank 3, Jak and Daxter 3 or Half-Life 2. But other companies suck-up to the press because they give them information about their games? They give them screen shots to publish? They let them play the game for hands-on features? Oh yeah, that makes TONS of sense. Damn yuo biasde mediaz!11!!!11!1!!! All three systems out there can be family friendly, all have games released to do so. Nintendo just seems to like to shun their older audience, the audience that yearns for games like GTA: SA and Halo 2. Instead they get half-hearted attempts like Geist.

And remember this thread was about the causes of the hype. I'm simply answering them.

You havn't answered anything. All you proven is that you're jealous of all the positive feedback numerous great games have recieved that you refuse to even play because of your blind fanboy jealously.

-------------------------

All hype can essentially be traced back to the company making the product because they control what is revealed, to who, and how. But the press, pop culture world, wait, underground fan campaigns, and of course MS's own marketing division are all responsible for the hype.

hype:
1) Excessive publicity and the ensuing commotion
2) Exaggerated or extravagant claims made especially in advertising or promotional material
3) Something deliberately misleading; a deception

Halo 2 = the first definition, thanks to its already established fanbase and the known fact that it is a terrific game. It does not, however, have the second two. An example of the second two would be Fable, a game that promised so much more than what it delivered.... but still turned out to be a solid game.

[Sandman]

Anyone who doesn't like Halo 2 definitely bought into the hype way too much. Don't let them tell you otherwise, because it's honestly the only way the can be disappointed (for an extended period of time) with the game. I didn't like single player on Halo much (it was alot better with Co-op... I got bored by myself), but so far in Halo 2, I'm having so much more fun. The enemy AI is some of the best I've seen in a game.

Anyone who complains about the graphics in the game is an absolute moron. Even the complaints about cut-scene graphics "popping up" are ridiculous. I've seen maybe a few issues, but it's hardly noticeable. I was LOOKING for it due to these people bitching about it and it was hard to find. The Halo 2 graphics are absolutely incredible. Not only that, but it runs at a solid framerate, and the loading times take less than a second. You can play the entire campaign, and aside from the loading when you start the game, never see a major loading sequence.

The guns. Oh my they are so much better in every way. There are more of them, they are 100x more balanced. The only weapon they got rid of was the assualt rifle, and they replaced it with the SMG and Battle Rifle. Both guns have alot to offer, and the dual wielding only adds to the strategy of what to add. In the other thread, someone said the sword is the "new pistol". They're wrong. There's only one sword in the game. If you're a smart player, just stay as far away from the person with the sword and snipe them, and they won't even be able to touch you. Many new team strategies revolve around the sword, but it's not like whoever has the sword is unstoppable.

The vehicles are awesome. They add so much to the multiplayer. There is nothing like driving around in the warthog in Coagulation, stealing the enemies flag, and having someone drive you back to your base as someone mounts the gun on back unloading on everything he sees. They added new playable vehicles such as the Wraith and another thing (I forget what its called but its basically the alien equivalent of the warthog). The Banshee is now playable in multiplayer. Jacking vehicles is probably the coolest thing ever. Jumping into an abyss, catching hold of a banshee in midair, and throwing the enemy out into oblivion is probably the most satisfying thing ever.

Halo 2 is the best online console experience to date. You can hook up with some friends and play a party mode, which is basically what it would be like at a LAN party or split screen, and you can play whatever game modes you'd like. Or, you can play matchmaking, and be paired up against people of equal skill in team matches, one on one, or clan matches. There is virtually no lag, but oh, when there is, the host switches to neutralize it! Sure, it might take a small loading period, but that's nothing compared to a game full of antagonizing lag.

Basically what I'm saying is that Halo 2 beefed up Halo 1 in every possible aspect. They left nothing unpolished. It's obvious that anyone who is disappointed in the game bought into the hype. This whole piece may be my "opinion", but anyone who says Halo 2 doesn't live up to Halo 1 is an absolute moron unless they bought into the hype. Actually, if they bought into way too much hype, then they're a moron too.

Just for the record, I was incredibly let down by Metroid Prime when it first came out. Now it's one of my favorite games ever. Last night I was playing Halo 2 with some friends that I played Halo with alot. Many of them were "disappointed" because they had no fucking idea how to use dual wielding, and they sucked. Once they got the hang of it, I can tell you that absolutely every one of them loved it.

And Halo 2 deserves more hype than any other game because it blows them all out of the water (in terms of consoles).

[Dread]

Since when is advertising or creating hype for a company's game a bad thing? If I invested money into a game, I would want the public to think its going to be amazing..

[X2_revolution]

WTF is all of this? Why can you just not enjoy a great game? Why so much debate over quality titles?

[Mach]

Damn does this guy love to quote every freaking sentence you write or what?! Frankly I'm flattered. Although I'm a bit worried about your ever increasing fanboy anger. Don't worry, it's just a game that's going to have it's critics. Even if you shelled $50 or so dollars of your (or mom's) money. That's life. And it's also life when people give you a rude awakening to the dream-world created by a one sided press and an ingenious corporate marketing scheme. So naturally you'd be angry. But it's okay. We're here to help! :help:

Oh, so because a few celebrities play Halo on the road or enjoy the game, it's automatically a part of the "hype machine". Looks like the GBA is a HUGE hype machine with all the people playing them on the go.
I've realized your main problem is that you just don't get it. You think on a different plane than most of us and that's probably because you've been sold into what I like to call "Xbox slavery". You obviously aren't aware of the power of star power when it comes to mainstream consumers. Whenever they hear a question about games some clueless casual actor or singer usually spouts out Halo. Halo has become the replacement for video games to the clueless casual stars that have only started playing games because their publicist tells them they're 'hip' now and there's money in that market. I have seen little to none celebrity endorsements for GBA. So I'm not quite sure what the hell your point is...but anyways. Here's just a small taste of the clueless celeb endorsement factor: http://www.vh1.com/news/articles/1492292/20041015/hoobastank.jhtml?headlines=true

Do you even read magazines? There are large cover stories for all games, I'm pretty sure GamePro just had a decent RE4 one. Halo 2 is a game worthy of the coverage, just as the magazines covered GTA: SA as much as they could.
Here's a question for you. Do you even read posts? Cause if you did you wouldn't be responding with yet another clueless post. I just said there's nothing wrong with A FEATURE STORY. But there is something wrong when all the magazines give out FEATURE STORIES for Halo 2 for the past 8 months straight. The magazines would rehash the same info and gloating about the game each month and include like a 5 or so page story each month about the game. I saw it my very own eyes kid. And I guess you could say yes I do read the garbage magazines you're referring to.

Those positive features came from, you know, hands-on time with the game. Especially multiplayer, Microsoft let companies play the game's multiplayer a lot sooner than they could play the single-player. Oh-0no!1!1 t3h magazines lik3d teh multiplayer and it si prov3n 2 b good wiht all teh reviews!!!1111!!11 Tell me, what issues could have been mentioned? So far.... pop-up graphics in cut scenes. That's. About. It. Oh yeah we all know that Microsoft certainly paid-off every single reviewer out there, and took their families on trips to Cancun so that they would give Halo 2 a good score. Microsoft also paid for all of their kids to go to private school, a new vehicle, paid off their houses and any credit card debt. I don't see bias.... I see the press liking a better game: Halo 2.
Here's where your lack of knowledge of the press world we live with really shines through! I and others however have a better understanding of the fellow press and I've got a good idea of how MS handled the Halo gig and other matters with the press through what actual members of the press have admitted and what I've seen myself. Oddly you're not that far off. MS butters up to the press big time. I'm not going to go into details as I suppose that wouldn't be fair to the magazines and such caught in the act, but I will say that it is so prevalent. Not just with MS though. A lot of these desperate companies that appeal to the hip, gore, sex crowd of mainstream gamers the press centers around loves to throw bones to the press. More about that later.
MS let them play previews alright. And yes they might have had a great time indeed. But that's been the case with all kinds of other games too. Nintendo gave out early play tests for Prime 2 that were absolutely exceptional. You couldn't find any flaws to pick at because they were just good quality demos that gave you a taste. But that didn't stop the press from speculating and assuming that there were going to be flaws upon it's release. That was clearly seen in all the previews I read in the different mainstream magazines and sites. They didn't gloat with Prime 2. They usually don't gloat with too many games (unless their excessively appealing to their core marketing audience: sex, gore, and 'hip' crowd). But they did with Halo 2. See you've touched on another hidden gem about this issue. It's a main reason why all the magazines cater to the mainstream gamers needs so much. I'm going to try to explain this as simple and quick as I can. Basically, it boils down to advertising. You see the magazines know that a lot of mainstream clueless gamers make up the bulk of their readership. They also know they buy into anything that has sex, gore, or something 'hip'. So what basically happens is the companies that spend a great deal advertising their games are the ones making games that appeal to sex, gore, and 'hip' (fad) buyers. These companies pay the big bucks. Magazines understand this. They know sex, gore, and latest fads sell so they capitalize on it. They give those games a lot of coverage and good feedback in exchange for some healthy advertiser loving and relations. Occasionally this is even translated into the actual review scores which is one of the lowest points of gaming journalism. But more on that later.
Basically it boils down to the fact that game magazines aren't your best source for objective critiquing or fair coverage. They cover their wallets before they'll cover yours. (IE. They'll direct you towards their money makers before they'll advise you to go with the game with the most quality.)
It's sad but that's what's to be expected in a media that is overrun by sensationalism and corrupt practices.
Nintendo is seen as out of step with the press. They don't care about buttering up to them. Press gets offended by that. (EX: They don't like all the times they had to wait for some Nintendo games to ship to retailers before they got their copy.) Nintendo's idea of family friendly games don't exactly match the advertisements you'll see littered in the magazines. Their distaste in gore, sex appeal, and 'hip' fads are seen as out of touch with the majority of the market (mainstream gamers) and therefore they should be criticized constantly. You shouldn't base criticism of a company's products based off of it's philosophy and practices but this obviously happens and has been admitted by the mainstream press.


So tell me, what are the disappointements? HOLY SHIT, THE CUTSCENE GRAPHICS POP-UP. I wonder how much Blockbuster will give me in trade-in credit for it. The things Nukeblaze mentioned are all items that take getting used to in FPS games. The control was tweaked and so were other areas of the game - once the game is played for a little while, he should have everything down pat. I know I'm starting to.
Well, I will say that most of the disappointments for the game are based off of nitpicks and preference. Some people found so many nitpicks that it turned them off. Others just did not prefer the game's style, set up, etc. But that's the whole point! Metroid Prime 2's majority of flaws mentioned in the press are little personal nitpicks. Why include personal little nitpicks and deduct points for them for one game, while you don't include any personal nitpicks or deduct points for them for another game (Halo 2)? The nitpicks are prevalent for both games. I mean c'mon. The best thing EGM could attack Prime 2 with was that it was 'convoluted' and hard. Since when was a game's shining point and biggest appeal seen as it's worst part? Since when was a game's quality and challenging difficulty level reason to chip off it's score? (Hmm, maybe it has to do with the fact that mainstream casual gamers aren't big fans of hard games?)

Yeah, you know what The Wind Waker was worth to me? A Rush Hour 2 DVD and two Staind CDs. Just ask CJ, that's what I traded my copy of the game to him for. Tony Hawk is so much more fun it's insane.
Yeah, well if that's your perogative, that's fine with me. Just don't expect any of us to give you much credibility as an objective trustworthy critic of games when you make laughable statements like that.

You know what? "G4TechTV" wasn't even around as a single channel when all those Nintendo games were released, so really, you don't have a point - at all. And you also have to realize, TV stations need to advertise, they need to make money. A bunch of shows on Zelda are not going to bring viewers in and make money. The game has it's Nintendo fanboy cult-like followers, and nothing else. Halo 2 and GTA: SA have the ability to reach all video game players, due to the simple fact that both are fun, good games that are very easy to pick-up and play. Zelda.... nah.
I did some research and it's true that G4 wasn't around for Smash Bros, Wind Waker, and what have you, but it was definately around for Mario Kart. It launched in April 03. Double Dash was the best selling game of the holiday season. Sure it didn't beat Halo 2 sales but you don't know that til after the game is out but the game days at G4 are given on the day it is released buddy so actual sales are irrelevant. Mario Kart is one of those ageless franchises that all kinds of gamers enjoy. It would've been a worthy game to celebrate. If nothing else it was worthy of a special show on it. But no, instead they save the special shows for games like X-men Legends. Hehehe. Wonder how that happened? Sure wasn't based off of it's sales or the quality of the game.
For all that Nintendo's franchises have done for the industry, you'd expect some kind of special recognition or tribute on G4, but you won't find any.


If byt "bolstered Halo 2 hype" you really mean "showed viewers how kick-ass of a game it is", then yes, yes they did.
Oh yeah, the fanbase and longetivity of the games really shows that. The only game people still talk about is SSB: M. It seems as though the other two have fallen off the face of the planet, especially Mario Kart: DD.
Bolstered as in 24 hours of television promoting Halo 2. Sounds like garbage to me.
And longevity? Perhaps Mario Kart and Wind Waker aren't being played as much as Halo is because GameCube actually has had a continuous stream of excellent titles to come along. Meanwhile Xbox sits patienty as gamers continuously harken back to Halo in anticipation for their second great game to play.


You havn't answered anything. All you proven is that you're jealous of all the positive feedback numerous great games have recieved that you refuse to even play because of your blind fanboy jealously.
If I was jealous for not having a game, I don't think I'd refuse to play it. I'd sneak a chance to play as much as I could if I was jealous over it. In fact, I've already been offered the chance to participate in a Halo 2 LAN party. Turned it down. Wasn't interested. Sorry. I just don't care for it. Tried the first, threw up. And even with all that said, my Xbox friend said he was sorely disappointed even after ignoring the hype (doesn't even read the mags).
So I don't know. Just not interested. Same with many other gamers. I'm sure it's an excellent game if you're really into all that stuff. But it's no godsend to gaming. (I guess it's a godsend to a game machine that's been waiting 3 years for it's 2nd crown game.)
But notice that is different from your goofy comments about Zelda being bad and the Tony Hawk series being way beyond it. That's something that's laughable to anyone on both sides of the spectrum. You could say Zelda doesn't appeal to you but still acknowledge that it is an excellent game to many gamers like I did with Halo 2. But no, you just make goofy statements like that and make them worse by throwing in ol' Hawk.

hype:
1) Excessive publicity and the ensuing commotion
2) Exaggerated or extravagant claims made especially in advertising or promotional material
3) Something deliberately misleading; a deception
I'll take all three definitions thank you.

[Mach]

Oh boy! Adam's in this thread for like over an hour now. Probably hard at work quoting every word I write like this:
Oh boy!
"That's right Mach. GameCube is for little boys!"

Adam's in this thread for like over an hour now.
"Actually, you're being one sided. According to my calculations it's approx. 45 minutes!"

Probably hard at work
"Haha, no. Work is only for Nintendo fanboys who don't have any new games to play. Who needs work when you have Halo!"

quoting every word I write
"You're doing it too!"[Had to adapt that tactic for this debate]


In all seriousness, I really don't have time to keep on writing essays for a Xbox fanboy. You guys have seen my stance. You understand it. Maybe it clarified a bit about how the mainstream press and the like work. Most of you probably agree. I rest my case....unless I see more quoting of every word I type.

[Michael Bluth]

Damn does this guy love to quote every freaking sentence you write or what?! Frankly I'm flattered. Although I'm a bit worried about your ever increasing fanboy anger. Don't worry, it's just a game that's going to have it's critics. Even if you shelled $50 or so dollars of your (or mom's) money. That's life. And it's also life when people give you a rude awakening to the dream-world created by a one sided press and an ingenious corporate marketing scheme. So naturally you'd be angry. But it's okay. We're here to help! :help:

The only critics this game has are people who have never played it. Imagine that, eh?

I've realized your main problem is that you just don't get it. You think on a different plane than most of us and that's probably because you've been sold into what I like to call "Xbox slavery". You obviously aren't aware of the power of star power when it comes to mainstream consumers. Whenever they hear a question about games some clueless casual actor or singer usually spouts out Halo. Halo has become the replacement for video games to the clueless casual stars that have only started playing games because their publicist tells them they're 'hip' now and there's money in that market. I have seen little to none celebrity endorsements for GBA. So I'm not quite sure what the hell your point is...but anyways. Here's just a small taste of the clueless celeb endorsement factor: http://www.vh1.com/news/articles/1492292/20041015/hoobastank.jhtml?headlines=true

No, I think like a normal person, not a "OMG if itz not on t3h Nintendo GameCubez i h8 it. fu microsoft & sony bkuz Nintendo was hear first no matter whut u say there was never a atari nintendo is t3h only roots consoul111111!!!111". You seriously have no clue as to what you're talking about, and your jealousy shows. Please tell me, what make these celebs clueless? My friend knows the band Nonpoint personally, and played Halo with them on the tour bus. And you know what? They kicked his ass. Why are celebs not allowed to play video games on the road? Why do you think they do it just to look "cool"? Heaven forbid they like the games themselves. And from your article:

"They told us that they loved Xbox, but it was hard for them to play on the road because they're traveling so much," explained Xbox product manager Carlos De Leon. "And that got us thinking about making a completely portable Xbox."

"To be a member of the Playaz Club, you have to have a religious, fanatical addiction to gaming," De Leon said. "But this is Hollywood, and a lot of people think of themselves as VIPs. We had to creatively dodge some phone calls."

In the three years that it's been out, "Halo" has become one of the more popular games that bands play on their tour buses. Therefore, some bands, perhaps mistakenly, think they're the best. Over the summer, Story of the Year reinforced that fact with Hoobastank when they boarded Hoobastank's bus with their own controllers and mopped the floor with Robb and guitarist Dan Estrin.

Here's a question for you. Do you even read posts? Cause if you did you wouldn't be responding with yet another clueless post. I just said there's nothing wrong with A FEATURE STORY. But there is something wrong when all the magazines give out FEATURE STORIES for Halo 2 for the past 8 months straight. The magazines would rehash the same info and gloating about the game each month and include like a 5 or so page story each month about the game. I saw it my very own eyes kid. And I guess you could say yes I do read the garbage magazines you're referring to.

Same info? Show me some proof. I seriously doubt you even read the Halo 2 features, because you know, the game will never appear on the GameCube so it automatically sucks.

Here's where your lack of knowledge of the press world we live with really shines through! I and others however have a better understanding of the fellow press and I've got a good idea of how MS handled the Halo gig and other matters with the press through what actual members of the press have admitted and what I've seen myself. Oddly you're not that far off. MS butters up to the press big time. I'm not going to go into details as I suppose that wouldn't be fair to the magazines and such caught in the act, but I will say that it is so prevalent. Not just with MS though. A lot of these desperate companies that appeal to the hip, gore, sex crowd of mainstream gamers the press centers around loves to throw bones to the press. More about that later.

"Fellow press", huh? What exclusives stories have you gotten? How about interviews? Inside stories? Nothing. Jack shit. Hey, how about that game development company of yours, how is that going, eh? You know nothing about Halo. You know nothing about Microsoft. You don't seem to know much of anything.

MS let them play previews alright. And yes they might have had a great time indeed. But that's been the case with all kinds of other games too. Nintendo gave out early play tests for Prime 2 that were absolutely exceptional. You couldn't find any flaws to pick at because they were just good quality demos that gave you a taste. But that didn't stop the press from speculating and assuming that there were going to be flaws upon it's release. That was clearly seen in all the previews I read in the different mainstream magazines and sites. They didn't gloat with Prime 2. They usually don't gloat with too many games (unless their excessively appealing to their core marketing audience: sex, gore, and 'hip' crowd).

So the press was gushing when Leisure Suit Larry came out, huh? How about Singles? Brute Force? Alias? BloodRayne 2? Outlaw Golf 2? Die Hard: Vendetta? Darkened Skye? Mace Griffin: Bounty Hunter? MTV's Celebrity Death Match? You are seriously making some of the most ignorant, hard-headed posts I have ever seen - anywhere. For some reason you think that all of the press - every single member of the press - has a conspiracy against Nintendo and everything that has to do with Nintendo. Do the voices in your head tell you that? Is that why you wear a tinfoil hat?

But they did with Halo 2. See you've touched on another hidden gem about this issue. It's a main reason why all the magazines cater to the mainstream gamers needs so much. I'm going to try to explain this as simple and quick as I can. Basically, it boils down to advertising. You see the magazines know that a lot of mainstream clueless gamers make up the bulk of their readership. They also know they buy into anything that has sex, gore, or something 'hip'. So what basically happens is the companies that spend a great deal advertising their games are the ones making games that appeal to sex, gore, and 'hip' (fad) buyers. These companies pay the big bucks. Magazines understand this. They know sex, gore, and latest fads sell so they capitalize on it. They give those games a lot of coverage and good feedback in exchange for some healthy advertiser loving and relations. Occasionally this is even translated into the actual review scores which is one of the lowest points of gaming journalism. But more on that later.

Oh, so Nintendo doesn't advertise. Now it all makes sense, thanks for explaning that. Nintendo is for teh ha7d c0r3 gamers because Nintendo is all underground and the only way to learn about their games it to play them, because they don't advertise at all and never have magazine features. Ever.

Basically it boils down to the fact that game magazines aren't your best source for objective critiquing or fair coverage. They cover their wallets before they'll cover yours. (IE. They'll direct you towards their money makers before they'll advise you to go with the game with the most quality.)
It's sad but that's what's to be expected in a media that is overrun by sensationalism and corrupt practices.

Hardly. I've seen magazines have ads for games and then give them a review between a 3 - 6 in the same issue. You're just talking out of your ass even more. Once again, it's good to see that Microsoft has taken the time to bribe 50 different sources and counting. Oh, and the millions of fans too. I'm still waiting for my check, however :(

Nintendo is seen as out of step with the press. They don't care about buttering up to them. Press gets offended by that. (EX: They don't like all the times they had to wait for some Nintendo games to ship to retailers before they got their copy.) Nintendo's idea of family friendly games don't exactly match the advertisements you'll see littered in the magazines. Their distaste in gore, sex appeal, and 'hip' fads are seen as out of touch with the majority of the market (mainstream gamers) and therefore they should be criticized constantly. You shouldn't base criticism of a company's products based off of it's philosophy and practices but this obviously happens and has been admitted by the mainstream press.

The problem with Nintendo is that they do not butter up to ANYBODY - including their fans. They do not do what their fans ask for, they do not care about their fans. They do not care about third party developers, either. They care about themselves and themselves only. If you knew anything about the business, you'd know that. All they do is stick to the titles they know will sell well, and do not bother venturing out. Did you ever stop and think that maybe gamers are getting sick and tired of playing the same 4 Nintendo games over and over again with a somewhat-new and uninspired rehashes? I know I was, which is why I dumped mine. Microsoft (and recently, Sony) have been giving gamers fresh titles, exciting titles, FUN titles. Why is why the press and gamers themselves like the games so much.

Well, I will say that most of the disappointments for the game are based off of nitpicks and preference. Some people found so many nitpicks that it turned them off. Others just did not prefer the game's style, set up, etc. But that's the whole point! Metroid Prime 2's majority of flaws mentioned in the press are little personal nitpicks. Why include personal little nitpicks and deduct points for them for one game, while you don't include any personal nitpicks or deduct points for them for another game (Halo 2)? The nitpicks are prevalent for both games. I mean c'mon. The best thing EGM could attack Prime 2 with was that it was 'convoluted' and hard. Since when was a game's shining point and biggest appeal seen as it's worst part? Since when was a game's quality and challenging difficulty level reason to chip off it's score? (Hmm, maybe it has to do with the fact that mainstream casual gamers aren't big fans of hard games?)

If being consoluted and hard is a game's shining point and its biggest appeals, that game has some problems. How about the game being FUN? Yeah, crazy concept eh? Do you know what the biggest nitpick with Halo 2 is? Graphical glitches seen during cutscenes. Yeah, that's about it. Good thing Halo 2 doesn't have multiple difficulty settings or terrerric gameplay, or that GTA: SA isn't incredibly open ended. What matters is that the games are HARD!!!!

Yeah, well if that's your perogative, that's fine with me. Just don't expect any of us to give you much credibility as an objective trustworthy critic of games when you make laughable statements like that.

Almost as laughable as the game itself. :(

I did some research and it's true that G4 wasn't around for Smash Bros, Wind Waker, and what have you, but it was definately around for Mario Kart. It launched in April 03. Double Dash was the best selling game of the holiday season. Sure it didn't beat Halo 2 sales but you don't know that til after the game is out but the game days at G4 are given on the day it is released buddy so actual sales are irrelevant. Mario Kart is one of those ageless franchises that all kinds of gamers enjoy. It would've been a worthy game to celebrate. If nothing else it was worthy of a special show on it. But no, instead they save the special shows for games like X-men Legends. Hehehe. Wonder how that happened? Sure wasn't based off of it's sales or the quality of the game.

It would've been a worthy game to celebrate.... if Nintendo would've done more than their normal sequel upgrades (somewhat better graphics, a new player or two, and some new tracks). No one's denying that it's still a pretty good game, but Nintendo could've done oh-so-much more. Halo 2 sold almost 5x the amount of units in 24 hours as Mario Kart did all throughout the month of November in 2003. It is not a blockbuster game.

For all that Nintendo's franchises have done for the industry, you'd expect some kind of special recognition or tribute on G4, but you won't find any.

So tell me, what have they done? Quite a bit of what they have done were thanks to other companies (Rare with DKC and Goldeneye, etc.).

Bolstered as in 24 hours of television promoting Halo 2. Sounds like garbage to me.

That's nice.

And longevity? Perhaps Mario Kart and Wind Waker aren't being played as much as Halo is because GameCube actually has had a continuous stream of excellent titles to come along. Meanwhile Xbox sits patienty as gamers continuously harken back to Halo in anticipation for their second great game to play.

Like what? As I said, the only GameCube game people still mention every once-and-a-while is Super Smash Brothers: Melee. While GCN owners sit twiddling their thumbs for the next Zelda games, Xbox owners have been enjoying Fable, Dead or Alive Ultimate and Halo 2 in the past few months. You know, fun games that will actually stick around. Maybe you'll get a game like that soon.

If I was jealous for not having a game, I don't think I'd refuse to play it. I'd sneak a chance to play as much as I could if I was jealous over it. In fact, I've already been offered the chance to participate in a Halo 2 LAN party. Turned it down. Wasn't interested. Sorry. I just don't care for it. Tried the first, threw up. And even with all that said, my Xbox friend said he was sorely disappointed even after ignoring the hype (doesn't even read the mags).

Yeah, because you most certainly seem as though you have better things to do, huh? You're worried that if you play the game, you will realize how awesome it is - just like we have all been saying since it came out. Since that terrible media has been claiming, the game is fantastic. Yep, your Xbox friend said that, sure thing. You know what? The only magazine I get now is GamePro, because I got a year free. Do you honestly think I take the time to go through that thing that much? I havn't had time to read Halo 2 articles, mainly because I don't want to spoil it for myself, so I came into the game totally openminded as well. And you know what? It blew me away.

So I don't know. Just not interested. Same with many other gamers. I'm sure it's an excellent game if you're really into all that stuff. But it's no godsend to gaming. (I guess it's a godsend to a game machine that's been waiting 3 years for it's 2nd crown game.)

So tell me, what is the GameCube's godsend to gaming? Sure doesn't seem like there is anything there to me.... or the vast majority of gamers. The only people that see a jewel are those fanboys who refused to get a Genesis, PSX or Dreamcast, simply because they have a company other than Nintendo's logo on it.

But notice that is different from your goofy comments about Zelda being bad and the Tony Hawk series being way beyond it. That's something that's laughable to anyone on both sides of the spectrum. You could say Zelda doesn't appeal to you but still acknowledge that it is an excellent game to many gamers like I did with Halo 2. But no, you just make goofy statements like that and make them worse by throwing in ol' Hawk.

Because the Tony Hawk franchise, to me, is much better. It's a hell of a lot more fun, and challenging. You know, that crazy word, FUN. But then again, hard games are the only good games.

I'll take all three definitions thank you.

And I'll take this one for you:

ig·no·rant

1) Lacking education or knowledge.
2) Showing or arising from a lack of education or knowledge
3) Unaware or uninformed.

[Colin™]

Good lord.

When world's collide.


My dos cents:
-Halo 2 was going to sell more than MP2, hype or not. Get over it.

[Blaksmoke]

Mario Kart and Fable suck!






I really have nothing else to say. I will leave now.

[Lord Worm]

How come I always get sworded first? Why can I never kill anyone with the goddamn sword? This game cheats.

[Michael Bluth]

Oh man I love the sword. I was just using it.... it's so friggin' sweet. As I said before, I've never switched guns as often in a game as I do in Halo 2.

[Bloodman]

The game didn't deserve the hype IMO. I dont think the sword was so great ither. And some vehicle speed decreased and made it less fun.

[Michael Bluth]

Oh.... so you suck at it. I see.

[Haris]

Owned.

[orcus116]

I think the swords a pretty cool weapon, though when you don't have one and you suck at the game like I do it makes it somewhat hard to kill your friend who knows what he's doing. So many times I had him down almost dead but he comes up from behind and WHAM swords me in the head.

[Blaksmoke]

Ixion, when you spam, it has to be more than one word!

[Haris]

Deepest Aplogies.

Spam Spam.

How's that?

[ch33f]

Halo 2 over-hyped? You fucking bet it is.

For the months leading up to Halo 2's release countless magazines and websites have been writing almost monthly "previews" for Halo 2 and never once stated any flaws or bugs in the game, do you not find it odd that no one ever commented on the games obvious graphical flaws or unbalanced combat system? For every article I read I always saw at least one "Best Game of 2004" comment relating to Halo 2, when it is obviously anything but that. All these previews created so much expectation and excitement from gaming fans, the casual gamers more then any. If all this wasn't enough to push the games sales through the roof a special 60 Minutes report on "gaming" that was 90% Halo 2 hype sure would. I was enraged when the reviews started to roll out and there where 10's as far as the eye could see, every review made brief statements about the flaws in the games graphics, single player length and story but that was it.

Now that it is out and I have talked to people about it and seen countless movies of game play footage, it is easy to see that this game is no where near what it was built up to be, sure to the majority it will be the game that they play for the weeks and months to come, but why? I haven’t seen one unique feature or idea in the whole 2 games (apart from sticky grenades and shields that recharge own their own without having to find pickups or manually recharge them) it seems like everything the fans say they liked about both Halo's is someone other then Bungie's idea.

Here's a list of the top of my head:

The ability to have duel weapons - Also seen in dozens of other games prior to Halo 2's and even Halo's release.

Dropping individual weapons for other weapons with different abilities etc. - The first game I remember using this technique was none other then the most success full multiplayer FPS ever, Counter-Strike.

An alien race invading Earth - Need I bother making a list.

A main character that never says a word and has the respect of all those around him and wears some very unique looking body armor - Doom? Half-Life?

Close range melee combat that is encouraged in multiplayer - Counter Strike knife wars have been around since it first game out and are extremely fun, and is almost exactly like that of your "unique" plasma sword wars/matches I guess if they are going to be stealing everyone else's idea they might as well take that as well.

Combat vehicles implemented into multiplayer - Codename Eagle, the father of Battlefield 1942, was the first game that I ever came across that used vehicles in the air and land and it came out back in the late 90's and it was one hell of a fun game, why not steal that as well!?

Stealing enemy vehicles - Bungie: "What the fuck is Grand Theft Auto? We are about being 100% unique an revolutionising the FPS genre!"

All it needs now is something blue.

What's even worse is they use all of these ideas that brought other people success and still can't get the game right, I have read complaints about the games over-exaggerated physics and Master Chief's lame jumping style, bad vehicle handling, unbalanced weapons a lame storyline and once again, at times repetitive bordering on boring level design. Why then was this game given so many perfect 10's why was it built up to be so huge and innovative when it wasn't either the gaming press is corrupt, they have a shit taste in games or they believed the hype created by Bungie in all those interviews and E3 footage like so many other people did.

Best Game Ever? Not even close
Best Game of 2004? Hell No
Best Game of the Month? Negative.

In brief, Halo is a game trying to simulate that of a PC FPS but it falls horibly short compared to the better FPS's on the PC, it recieved so much attention when it came on the Xbox because it was the first PC style FPS to even come out on a console, that and the fact that Halo 1 was the only decent title worth buying at the time of its release.

[HylianKWG]

Didn't they do some sort of advertising on slurpees to or something?

[Michael Bluth]

Oh SHYT Shane those R TOTALLY t3h selling points of Halo 2!!1111!!!! Oh SHYT u pWND uss111111!!!!111!!!!111!!!

[ch33f]

Well please inform me on what it was that made everyone flock to this game like a bunch of sheep?

[Michael Bluth]

The fact that it is, you know, fun. It has a very well-constructed story, virtually perfect gameplay and pacing, fantastic multiplayer and some of the best graphics to ever grace a console. Ever. You should, you know, actually play it sometime.

[ch33f]

The fact that it is, you know, fun. It has a very well-constructed story, virtually perfect gameplay and pacing, fantastic multiplayer and some of the best graphics to ever grace a console. Ever. You should, you know, actually play it sometime.

If a 10 hour experience and a token alien invasion storyline is fun, then we have very different oppinions on fun. "Virtually perfect gameplay" by this you mean unbalanced weapons, even worse vehicle handling then in the 1st game and the same boring enemies that you faced in Halo 1. And fantasic multiplayer means the same as in the first but with better buggy graphics, duel weapons and some new maps? Sure is has good graphics for console standards, but the Xbox can barley handle streaming textures of that quality which is why some don't even appear at times. I will play it one of these days, but I am not buying a chunk old technology 2 (maybe even 3) generations behind a gaming computer to do so.

[=NukeBlaze=]

I played both games untill end, and i still like halo 1 a lot better.

Did I mention I cannot stand Legendary mode on Halo 2? Thanks to not thinking, it is almost impossible to get anyone without running out of ammo long before all the enemies are dead. This presents a problem in beat the game on this level on this difficultly.

You people should have really played halo PC online. Lots of fun. Sure the weapons are more balanced in this game, but what about the now crappy needler and plasma pistol charge shot? Enemy AI has not imporved becuase they can jump on a box or duck, they are still dumb as a box of rocks on any level of difficultly. The only reason they present a challenge on a higher level is the fact that they alll run around with 2 or the same gun, and when the wind picks up half your sheild goes missing. And instead of 5 elites on normal, you get 10 or so with super shielding. It is just like mario cart 64, the higher the level the AI were only made them cheat to reach more of a challenge to the player.

[orcus116]

virtually perfect gameplay

THIS is very subjective. Personally I'd take GTA gameplay over Halo 2 gameplay anyday. My reasons is that GTA has alot more variety in things to do plus it has a massive free roaming environment. But as you stated before you love blowing shit up and by all means Halo 2 was built exactly for that purpose.

[Haris]

You realise you're comparing an open ended third person action adventure with an FPS.

Die.

[Michael Bluth]

If a 10 hour experience and a token alien invasion storyline is fun, then we have very different oppinions on fun. "Virtually perfect gameplay" by this you mean unbalanced weapons, even worse vehicle handling then in the 1st game and the same boring enemies that you faced in Halo 1. And fantasic multiplayer means the same as in the first but with better buggy graphics, duel weapons and some new maps? Sure is has good graphics for console standards, but the Xbox can barley handle streaming textures of that quality which is why some don't even appear at times. I will play it one of these days, but I am not buying a chunk old technology 2 (maybe even 3) generations behind a gaming computer to do so.

10 hours if you just blast right through it, I'm still taking my time. You don't even know what the storyline is, and don't say you do. Hell, I don't even know what the rest of the storyline is, all I know is that I have enjoyed what I've seen so far. Unbalanced weapons? More like incredibly balanced weapons. Bungie went trough and tweaked everything to work much better, and it shows. So you know the vehicles handle worse..... how? If anything the controls for the vehicles, just like the player controls, are much tighter. The added features to the vehicles are nice, too, including boost and the real-time damage. The graphics are only a little bit buggy in the cutscenes, on some of the cutscenes - everything else looks fantastic. 2 or 3 generations behind? Wow, I must not be up-to-date on the latest computer games at all, because the games you must have in mind must be amazing. But then again, when I think about it, games like DOOM 3 and Half-Life 2 are being created for the Xbox at this very moment. Kinda hard to make a game run on hardware 2 or 3 generations behind, isn't it?

[Colin™]

If a 10 hour experience and a token alien invasion storyline is fun, then we have very different oppinions on fun

Says the man who's been all about Half-Life 2 for the past year.

[csninja]

Here's a list of the top of my head:

The ability to have duel weapons - Also seen in dozens of other games prior to Halo 2's and even Halo's release.

Dropping individual weapons for other weapons with different abilities etc. - The first game I remember using this technique was none other then the most success full multiplayer FPS ever, Counter-Strike.

An alien race invading Earth - Need I bother making a list.

A main character that never says a word and has the respect of all those around him and wears some very unique looking body armor - Doom? Half-Life?

Close range melee combat that is encouraged in multiplayer - Counter Strike knife wars have been around since it first game out and are extremely fun, and is almost exactly like that of your "unique" plasma sword wars/matches I guess if they are going to be stealing everyone else's idea they might as well take that as well.

Combat vehicles implemented into multiplayer - Codename Eagle, the father of Battlefield 1942, was the first game that I ever came across that used vehicles in the air and land and it came out back in the late 90's and it was one hell of a fun game, why not steal that as well!?

Stealing enemy vehicles - Bungie: "What the fuck is Grand Theft Auto? We are about being 100% unique an revolutionising the FPS genre!"

well...yea shane, of course they have been done before. But halo 2 does it better. mostly dual wielding in other games just one trigger activates both. i could go on, but the point is that halo 2 did it better than other games did. THey never said its never been done.

[X2_revolution]

Halo 2 over-hyped? You fucking bet it is.

For the months leading up to Halo 2's release countless magazines and websites have been writing almost monthly "previews" for Halo 2 and never once stated any flaws or bugs in the game, do you not find it odd that no one ever commented on the games obvious graphical flaws or unbalanced combat system? For every article I read I always saw at least one "Best Game of 2004" comment relating to Halo 2, when it is obviously anything but that. All these previews created so much expectation and excitement from gaming fans, the casual gamers more then any. If all this wasn't enough to push the games sales through the roof a special 60 Minutes report on "gaming" that was 90% Halo 2 hype sure would. I was enraged when the reviews started to roll out and there where 10's as far as the eye could see, every review made brief statements about the flaws in the games graphics, single player length and story but that was it.

Now that it is out and I have talked to people about it and seen countless movies of game play footage, it is easy to see that this game is no where near what it was built up to be, sure to the majority it will be the game that they play for the weeks and months to come, but why? I haven’t seen one unique feature or idea in the whole 2 games (apart from sticky grenades and shields that recharge own their own without having to find pickups or manually recharge them) it seems like everything the fans say they liked about both Halo's is someone other then Bungie's idea.

Here's a list of the top of my head:

The ability to have duel weapons - Also seen in dozens of other games prior to Halo 2's and even Halo's release.

Dropping individual weapons for other weapons with different abilities etc. - The first game I remember using this technique was none other then the most success full multiplayer FPS ever, Counter-Strike.

An alien race invading Earth - Need I bother making a list.

A main character that never says a word and has the respect of all those around him and wears some very unique looking body armor - Doom? Half-Life?

Close range melee combat that is encouraged in multiplayer - Counter Strike knife wars have been around since it first game out and are extremely fun, and is almost exactly like that of your "unique" plasma sword wars/matches I guess if they are going to be stealing everyone else's idea they might as well take that as well.

Combat vehicles implemented into multiplayer - Codename Eagle, the father of Battlefield 1942, was the first game that I ever came across that used vehicles in the air and land and it came out back in the late 90's and it was one hell of a fun game, why not steal that as well!?

Stealing enemy vehicles - Bungie: "What the fuck is Grand Theft Auto? We are about being 100% unique an revolutionising the FPS genre!"

All it needs now is something blue.

What's even worse is they use all of these ideas that brought other people success and still can't get the game right, I have read complaints about the games over-exaggerated physics and Master Chief's lame jumping style, bad vehicle handling, unbalanced weapons a lame storyline and once again, at times repetitive bordering on boring level design. Why then was this game given so many perfect 10's why was it built up to be so huge and innovative when it wasn't either the gaming press is corrupt, they have a shit taste in games or they believed the hype created by Bungie in all those interviews and E3 footage like so many other people did.

Best Game Ever? Not even close
Best Game of 2004? Hell No
Best Game of the Month? Negative.

In brief, Halo is a game trying to simulate that of a PC FPS but it falls horibly short compared to the better FPS's on the PC, it recieved so much attention when it came on the Xbox because it was the first PC style FPS to even come out on a console, that and the fact that Halo 1 was the only decent title worth buying at the time of its release.

Remeber that this is coming from probally the most biased opinion on the site. He hates Halo 2 so much just because it is the only FPS better than Half-Life 2. You see....if HL2 was a guy and wanted sexual favors from him, Shane would give them to him.

[orcus116]

He hates Halo 2 so much just because it is the only FPS better than Half-Life 2. .

Have you even played HL2 yet? If not your opinion is invalid as well since there hasn't been any time to prove that Halo 2 might be better than HL2.

[Travis]

If I had the money to upgrade my PC, I'd get HL2. But since it makes more sense to get a game that's probably on par with it on the 200 dollar machine I already have, I'll stick with Halo 2 and have endless amounts of fun, despite whatever critics say.

[Michael Bluth]

And critics are saying it's the 2nd best game released.... ever....

http://www.gamerankings.com/itemrankings/simpleratings.asp


Subject to change, but it has a nice bit of padding under it after so many reviews.

[Shayde]

And critics are saying it's the 2nd best game released.... ever....

http://www.gamerankings.com/itemrankings/simpleratings.asp


Subject to change, but it has a nice bit of padding under it after so many reviews.

Yeah second to Zelda...a NINTENDO GAME~!

OmFg I just pwned you!!!!!1




Halo 2 is a good game. But, I don't feel it deserves all the scores its gotten. I'd give it anywhere from a 9 - 9.7. It does though deserve the sales...Bungie/MS did a good job of appealing to the masses (casual gamers).

Half of the people I know have Halo 2, I never knew even played videogames. Most of them only have a Xbox and Halo. Don't know why..but, somehow the Xbox and Halo appeals to them.
I like the PA comic of it (http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2004/20041108l.jpg)


/end

[Xer0]

Who the fuck cares about Halo and Zelda and Tony Hawk? WH can't they just make a Skies of Arcadia sequel?

Amen :D

But seriously, whats the point for this thread? I mean people bitch when i great game doesn't sell that well yet now people are bitching a great game is selling well, wtf? Look, love it or hate it, Halo is a great game and its selling on its merits, all 125 million dollars worth of them.

[ch33f]

Wow, I must not be up-to-date on the latest computer games at all, because the games you must have in mind must be amazing. But then again, when I think about it, games like DOOM 3 and Half-Life 2 are being created for the Xbox at this very moment. Kinda hard to make a game run on hardware 2 or 3 generations behind, isn't it?

I meant in terms of graphical performance but it also lacks "wang" in all other areas compared to the latest technology. Let’s make some comparisons,

PC:

Video Card:

Nvidia GeForce 6800 Ultra:

Memory - 256 MB
Core Clock Speed - 450+ MHz
Pixel Pipelines - 16
Anisotropic and Anti-Aliasing modes capable of 16x and 8x respectively
Pixel Shader 3.0 Support
Vertex Shader 3.0 Support
Pixel Fill Rate - 6.4 Gpixels/sec
3D Maximum resolution - 2048x1536 with 16.7M colors

Xbox

Video Card:

GeForce 3 based chipset (that's right, the one before 4, 5 and 6, if you can count then that is 3 generations of graphic technology):

Memory - 64 MB
Core Clock Speed - 233 MHz
Pixel Pipelines - 4
2x Anti-Aliasing
Trilinear Anisotropic Filtering
No pixel shader support
No Vertex shader Support
Pixel Fill Rate - 0.932Gpixels/sec

"Games like DOOM 3 and Half-Life 2 are being created for the Xbox at this very moment."

Games like Doom 3 and Half-Life 2 can run on PC's older then the Xbox, what is your point? The graphics can be toned down drastically for any game via lower resolution textures etc. See this example of a comparison between the Xbox Doom 3 and the PC Doom 3.

PC:
http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/532/532505/doom-3-20040722105619097.jpg

Note the high quality textures and the resolution of the image, Doom 3 would run with a better frame rate on a resolution this big compared to a toned down version of Doom 3 on the Xbox on a much lower resolution.

Xbox:
http://xboxmedia.ign.com/xbox/image/article/514/514245/doom-3-20040512034750513.jpg

Looks like complete ass, stretched textures and low quality everything.

And critics are saying it's the 2nd best game released.... ever....

http://www.gamerankings.com/itemrankings/simpleratings.asp


Subject to change, but it has a nice bit of padding under it after so many reviews.

I don't know about you, but I am not going to pay attention to a site that has "NFL 2K1" as the 10th best game ever made, dream on, review scores mean nothing when you are comparing games of different genres and different times.

Says the man who's been all about Half-Life 2 for the past year.

Half-Life's alien invasion had an original story line behind it, it had a deeper feeling which created a more atmospheric environment for the game. The original Halo's story line was shallow to say the least, I never once felt a part of the world in which I was in and there was no originality to be seen anywhere in it's story, just some generic kick ass military man fighting waves of aliens through boring levels.

Remember that this is coming from probably the most biased opinion on the site. He hates Halo 2 so much just because it is the only FPS better than Half-Life 2. You see....if HL2 was a guy and wanted sexual favors from him, Shane would give them to him.

Halo 2 better then Half-Life 2? Dream on man, Half Life 2 has the most advanced AI in an FPS we have ever seen, all enemies react with the environment in such a way that you would think they are real life players, just about every enemy movement made is un-scripted. I take it that you already know about its graphical superiority and it's far more advanced physics system. But you might not know about the new innovative technology used in the game.

For Example:

Brand new technology has been developed especially for Half Life 2, this technology will give main characters a facial structure containing "muscles" like that of a human face, this technology makes it possible to create game characters that make 100% realistic facial expressions and perfectly sync the voice acting to the character. This was implemented due to the fact that like the original Half Life, Half Life 2 will contain no cut scenes. This is a world first for any game to have such technology in the thick of in-game action.

[Michael Bluth]

Comparing specs from a video game console to a PC is apples and oranges. A console can be as strong, if not stronger, than a PC with highest specs due to the fact that it does not have to worry about running programs such as an OS. The Xbox may seem old now, but we all know that for its $150 price tag, it has incredible bang for its buck when it comes to hardware performance - very close to the top-of-the-line PCs of today. PCs are always evolving constantly - consoles, on the other hand, are evolving about every 4 or 5 years. Expect Xbox Next to totally spank the current generation of PC gaming at the time, and then PC gaming will then catch-up to Xbox Next, PS3 and Revolution as their lifecycle goes on. It is simple common sense. The Xbox was released November 15, 2001. Half-Life 2? November 16th, 2004. I'd have to hope it would feature a good performance.



On a side note, I absolutely love the fact that Bungie got Steve Vai to do the guitar work. It's awesome.

[ch33f]

I also forgot to mention that there is new technology in mother boards that allows you to run 2 of the PC video cards stated in my previous post (via PCIe) which doubles its graphic output.

And Adam, I know all that about consoles but you stated the Xbox was compareable to a PC in terms of graphical quality by saying Doom 3 and HL2 were coming to the Xbox like they were going to be as good as the PC versions. And you are wrong the Xbox isn't even close to the latest PC's.

P.S. - I challenge you on that statement about the Xbox Next being better then PC Gaming machines, they might be better then the current technology but by the time the Xbox Next and PS3 come out the next gen of computer graphic cards will be aswell, at the rate things are progressing and the rate at which people are buying new computer hardware I think it is possible that a console will never be more powerfull then the best available PC again. Even on the day it launches.

[Xer0]

^Yet how much will the best available P.C be and how much will that said game system be? Look, the Xbox, with 3 year old tech is comparing favoribly with modern computers in terms of performance in games. You can't say that for those 3 year old computers unless you wasted a retardedly large amount of money on them. Also, anything will be better if you keep on pouring money into it, thats a given, however how much better will the top of the line PC be then the PS3, Rev, and Xenon? Maybe a little bit, and thats if you have the money to make it that good. Baisiclly, the system is the best bang for your buck that you can get, no doubt about that. Sure, the P.C has the potential to be better, however, it most likely wont.

[orcus116]

It doesn't matter if HL2 and Doom 3 are being made for the Xbox. I'm strongly sticking to the majority opinion that mouse/keyboard >>> dual analog.

[Viper]

Hype. Was it overhyped? Depends on what source you look at.

Media - The source of the hype. Was paid for some of it too so of course it had to live up to the hype they created with their reviews and scores.

Casuals - Absolutely lives up to the hype. Well when you are comparing it to other mainstreamer games, then of course it will.

Gamers - Doesn't come close to the hype. This game received 10 times the hype of Ocarina of Time and even the paid reviews haven't scored Halo 2 higher.


PC Gamers - They just point and snicker while playing superior games so of course Halo 2 doesn't live up to the hype to them.

Sales - A direct product of the hype and lack of competing software on system (Remember, that is you reasoning for SCII doing better on GC, Adam)


What matters is that the games are HARD!!!!
Hey, isn't this what many publications were saying was wrong with MP2?

*shrugs* Wimps.

Before anyone comes back that I'm bashing the game, stfu first. Thank you. Saves me another post.

Halo 2 is no doubt a very good game. It simply is not as good as the hype that surrounded it, regardless of where it came from.

Halo 2 Hype > Halo 2

[aerofan113]

Halo 2 was the best game i have played in a long time. I am more than happy and you Nintendo fanboys need to shut the hell up. My god you whine more than any other group of people I have ever encountered or heard of.

[Mach]

Sorry Adam, you might've been caught off guard from my recent absence but I'm sure you know I wouldn't let you off that easily now would I? Hehe, grab some food and drink my friend. It's all in good fun.
Let me first clarify a little something. Haven't you noticed how angry and viscious this Xbox diehard fanboy gets when someone even dares answer his thread's question with statements that could be seen as negative towards anything related to Halo? LOL. Have I ever said once that Halo or Halo 2 sucks? Am I the one that made ignorant fanboy statements like "Tony Hawk and Rush Hour is better than Zelda!!11 lolololol." No. In fact, I've said several times that the Halo series is an excellent series deserved of high marks.(I and many others just didn't care for it too much.) But the excessive hype and extreme banter of the biased mainstream press is something that is hated by millions and needs to spoken about.

The only critics this game has are people who have never played it. Imagine that, eh?
Um, critics are people whose job is to review the games. That's what I was talking about.

No, I think like a normal person, not a "OMG if itz not on t3h Nintendo GameCubez i h8 it. fu microsoft & sony bkuz Nintendo was hear first no matter whut u say there was never a atari nintendo is t3h only roots consoul111111!!!111". You seriously have no clue as to what you're talking about, and your jealousy shows. Please tell me, what make these celebs clueless? My friend knows the band Nonpoint personally, and played Halo with them on the tour bus. And you know what? They kicked his ass. Why are celebs not allowed to play video games on the road? Why do you think they do it just to look "cool"?

What's with all the little numbers and odd spelling integrated in your sentences? And I already explained why your jealousy accusation is totally false and ridiculous.
C'mon Adam, I'd expect more from you than that. You've got to be kidding me if you think celebs don't cluelessly endorse and talk about products their publicists (or 'hip' trends) tell them is popular at the moment. Everyone knows it's prevalent for all kinds of products and it's been happening for years.
I'm happy for your friend and 'nonpoint' but sadly that's a nonpoint in this discussion.

Same info? Show me some proof. I seriously doubt you even read the Halo 2 features, because you know, the game will never appear on the GameCube so it automatically sucks.
How am I supposed to show you proof of magazine features on a forum? Want me to scan all 200 or so pages in? No thank you. But it is most definately there. I and millions of others are very aware of the ridiculous gloating and fanboyish coverage of Halo 2 by the press. Multiple feature story articles in each magazine for months. Most games are supposed to get just one feature story.


"Fellow press", huh? What exclusives stories have you gotten? How about interviews? Inside stories? Nothing. Jack shit. Hey, how about that game development company of yours, how is that going, eh? You know nothing about Halo. You know nothing about Microsoft. You don't seem to know much of anything.
Wow. Talk about cheap shots! If half the things we have in the works were revealed you'd be eating those words right now. Instead we'll do our talking on the scoreboard. Same with my studio.
But yes, fellow press. I have the pleasure of meeting and talking to many people in the game press. Most are really cool people. But I've learned a lot about the way they work and what they do. They've told things they'd want to remain confidential about what their publication has done and things they've seen and heard about from other press outlets.


So the press was gushing when Leisure Suit Larry came out, huh? How about Singles? Brute Force? Alias? BloodRayne 2? Outlaw Golf 2? Die Hard: Vendetta? Darkened Skye? Mace Griffin: Bounty Hunter? MTV's Celebrity Death Match? You are seriously making some of the most ignorant, hard-headed posts I have ever seen - anywhere. For some reason you think that all of the press - every single member of the press - has a conspiracy against Nintendo and everything that has to do with Nintendo. Do the voices in your head tell you that? Is that why you wear a tinfoil hat?
Heheh, those are some lousy games you came up with. And that basically explains why the press didn't actually 'gush' about those games when they came out. All of those weren't what you'd call "heavy hitters". They range from trash to medium popularity/budget. Therefore the money isn't going to be high on those titles. The money comes in the with major players who have the major budget/popularity 'hip', gore, and sex games. The companies don't necessarily have to be big, because it's all about the budget given to the particular game. Magazines know that when it comes to money, the direction Nintendo goes (family friendly gaming) isn't profitable or what they personally prefer.
Now I never said every single member of the press. I think that's what you'd call one of those exaggerations.

Oh, so Nintendo doesn't advertise. Now it all makes sense, thanks for explaning that. Nintendo is for teh ha7d c0r3 gamers because Nintendo is all underground and the only way to learn about their games it to play them, because they don't advertise at all and never have magazine features. Ever.
Did I say they didn't advertise? Once again you've responded with lame comebacks that don't even refute what I said. You've done that with the past few paragraphs.
Of course Nintendo advertises. But as any man can see they sure don't advertise much in the press world. The most you'll see out of them is a one page ad. That's not what I'd call the mega-money at all. I've seen kid's pasta snack ads in game magazines that were bigger than Nintendo's. That's not the point though. Anyways...lol.

Hardly. I've seen magazines have ads for games and then give them a review between a 3 - 6 in the same issue. You're just talking out of your ass even more. Once again, it's good to see that Microsoft has taken the time to bribe 50 different sources and counting. Oh, and the millions of fans too. I'm still waiting for my check, however :(
LOL, here's another response that dodges around the issue. I clearly said in my post that inflated review scores were usually rare (I'm giving the benefit of the doubt). It's usually more along the lines of excessive amounts of coverage, previews, features, and an odd 100% positive outlook on some games. Ex: Prime 2 and Halo 2. Both games had demos. Both were seen as extremely good. Prime 2 received no where near the amount of coverage Halo 2 received. Prime 2 also had many negative assumptions and speculations before it's release while Halo 2 had absolutely nothing but glowing praise before it's release.
While bribery is actually a lot more common then we'd all like to believe it's not the main source of the bias in the media. Money, pop culture (sex, gore, etc), personal distaste, old grudges with Nintendo's press approach, and simply business make up the majority. Although bribery does take place, just not that often and not in the traditional form of bribery.

The problem with Nintendo is that they do not butter up to ANYBODY - including their fans. They do not do what their fans ask for, they do not care about their fans. They do not care about third party developers, either. They care about themselves and themselves only. If you knew anything about the business, you'd know that. All they do is stick to the titles they know will sell well, and do not bother venturing out. Did you ever stop and think that maybe gamers are getting sick and tired of playing the same 4 Nintendo games over and over again with a somewhat-new and uninspired rehashes? I know I was, which is why I dumped mine. Microsoft (and recently, Sony) have been giving gamers fresh titles, exciting titles, FUN titles. Why is why the press and gamers themselves like the games so much
This is just simply inaccurate. Reality doesn't match. Nintendo is listening to their fans. They are reaching out to 3rd party developers with the GC. Therefore they butter up to both. They also have done a decent job of working with the press better even though there's still the many isssues. They're always trying to innovate and I don't believe I see "the 4 same old Nintendo games". Sony and MS giving fresh, FUN, exciting titles? LOL. C'mon now, this is way out of step with reality. Statements like these totally throws out all credibility. Of course Sony and MS make good games too, but they're all well known for having uninspired, carbon copy, trendy titles that appeal to mainstream gamers.

If being consoluted and hard is a game's shining point and its biggest appeals, that game has some problems. How about the game being FUN? Yeah, crazy concept eh? Do you know what the biggest nitpick with Halo 2 is? Graphical glitches seen during cutscenes. Yeah, that's about it. Good thing Halo 2 doesn't have multiple difficulty settings or terrerric gameplay, or that GTA: SA isn't incredibly open ended. What matters is that the games are HARD!!!!
First, what the hell is 'consoluted'? I believe you're referring to EGM's idiotic statement that Prime 2's convoluted levels were a bad thing. What I said was that is one of the main things that makes people love Metroid so much. The levels are puzzling, challenging, confusing at times. It's supposed to make you feel lost and alone. And difficulty is always a great thing to have in games. They've been stripping it away each year mainstream gamers continue to flood the market. Yeah, and I don't think the biggest nitpick for Halo 2 is cutscene glitches. Hehehe.

It would've been a worthy game to celebrate.... if Nintendo would've done more than their normal sequel upgrades (somewhat better graphics, a new player or two, and some new tracks). No one's denying that it's still a pretty good game, but Nintendo could've done oh-so-much more. Halo 2 sold almost 5x the amount of units in 24 hours as Mario Kart did all throughout the month of November in 2003. It is not a blockbuster game.
Dear God! The guy's done it again! LOL! Going WAY off topic instead of refuting my statements and making up pointless new arguements.
I believe we were talking about the PRE-RELEASE BUILD UP to Mario Kart. We're not talking about sales. That has nothing to do with G4 pre-release coverage or a game day.
I guess this is to be expected when you can't refute my original statements.

Like what? As I said, the only GameCube game people still mention every once-and-a-while is Super Smash Brothers: Melee. While GCN owners sit twiddling their thumbs for the next Zelda games, Xbox owners have been enjoying Fable, Dead or Alive Ultimate and Halo 2 in the past few months. You know, fun games that will actually stick around. Maybe you'll get a game like that soon.
I think I've made this very clear before. GameCube has had plenty of gems come out. That's one reason why we aren't still buying some of the games mentioned like Xbox gamers have been doing with Halo. Ever think that it's got something to do with the fact that Xbox gamers have had barely anything excellent to play since Halo. 3 YEARS of blandness waiting for their sequel in shining armor. Meanwhile GC owners go through all kinds of good quality 1st party gems and the like.

Anyways, after about that I've grown to tired and bored wasting my time responding to every little paragraph you write. The other paragraphs meant nothing anyways and were hopelessly nonsensical and off topic. So I'll wrap things up.

ig·no·rant

1) Lacking education or knowledge.
2) Showing or arising from a lack of education or knowledge
3) Unaware or uninformed.
Ignorant?
1) I've got an education and some knowledge.
2) Didn't show anything based off of the fact that I didn't know.
3) I don't think I was unaware or uninformed.
If I am unaware, I guess it's not my fault then!

Anyways I cracked open a dictionary to find out what the hell a "consoluted" was and instead I found this:

re·tard·ed
Pronunciation: ri-'tärd-&d
Function: adjective
: slow or limited in intellectual or emotional development : characterized by mental retardation
http://pic8.picturetrail.com/VOL253/2093594/4144470/51457897.jpg

Nah, I'm just joking. I'm not going to stoop low and respond with name calling as well or anything. It's all in good fun.


Anyways, thanks for wasting our time with a response that was went off topic faster than an ADHD kid in reading class. I know you feel passionately about that your game. I'm proud of you. I really am. You've worked hard. I know it's hard work. You've fought like a good American patriot. Killed a couple monsters with your needler. Maybe even experienced a few disc errors. But you pulled through. You waited 3 years for this game. And I'm really happy for you. It's probably a wonderful game in many people's eyes. I acknowledge that. It's got a good FPS setup, good graphics, production, etc. But you asked about the hype in this thread. And I answered. Simple as that.

I and many others have found the blatant bias and irresponsible journalism of the mainstream press to be ridiculous and inexcusable. People are tired of it. They were tired of it with general cable news too. We got FOX News and talk radio in response. Now we're tired of the bias in the gaming press. It's time someone started speaking out about it.

But anyways good discussion. I hope this wraps things up. Tried to reshift things back on a positive note to end things. I've explained my arguement for the biases and hype. Many people agree with me. You, however, did not. Have fun though and take it easy.

To two gaming worlds that will never see eye to eye!
:cheers:

[aerofan113]

How bout we settle this by sayin that Nintendo could stand to advertise a whole lot more. Eh?

[Mach]

How bout we settle this by sayin that Nintendo could stand to advertise a whole lot more. Eh?
Hmmm. Not that easy of a solution. See, Nintendo is advertising more. Just not in the magazines and what have you. They're advertising on television a heck of a lot more. It's got a heck of a lot more to do with saying the press needs to change or there's going to be a revolution of sorts like we saw with cable news.
I like the latter option better. :)

[Sandman]

Shane, you're a dumb fuck. You're saying all this stuff about a game you've never played. Maybe your points would be valid if they made any sense but they don't.

First of all, a game is going to take ideas from other games. If Halo 2 didn't use any ideas from other games, it probably wouldn't be an FPS because it's copying off of DOOM. The only difference in Halo 2 is that it encompasses ALL of the best features from an FPS and makes them better and smarter. Please tell me all of the great and innovative features of Half-Life 2. Believe me, I'm really interested in the game, but I don't see anything all too innovative about it.

Unbalanced weapons? Wow, you're an idiot. Deciding which weapons to duel wield has never been tougher. Go for brute force with 2 SMG's? One plasma pistol and an SMG? Just one gun so I can launch grenades? Each combo has its advantages, and no combo of guns is clearly better than another. In Halo 1, yes the weapons were unbalanced.

Master Cheifs lame jumping style? Uhh, what? He just like, jumps... like anyone else would. Only higher because there's less gravity.

Bad vehicle handling? Nope, it's pretty good. Plus, there's new features on the vehicles such as speed bursts, which make it cool. On Banshees you can do barrel rolls and backflips.. oh they must be copying Star Fox.

Over exaggerated physics? You know, there's less gravity on the levels of the game. So yes, things react like that. It's got one of the best physics systems around. Sure, it's nowhere near Half-Life 2, but it's still solid for a console game.

Repetitive level design? I'm on level 11, and I haven't seen ANY repetitiveness in the levels. Seriously. I don't like single player ALL THAT MUCH, but I like it alot more than most single player games that I play. Halo 1 was hell with the repetitive levels, and I even liked that game.

Shane, you are the worst kind of fanboy. One that hates something without even eplaying it. You're one of the people, who if you DID play Halo 2, you would hate it because you're focusing on how it compares to Half-Life 2, rather than how fun it is. Why can't you just respect the game for what it is? I don't think all these people are having so much fun with the game because of hype. So far it's easily my favorite game of all time. It's not like I'm lying to myself because I anticipated it so much. I truly love it.

[ch33f]

But why is it your favourite game of all time, don't say because it is fun, give me something solid so I can understand the mental state of mind you all have with this game, because all I can see is a generic FPS that offers no more then any first person shooter on the PC, but with worse controls.

[HylianKWG]

Anyone read the article in the new EGM about how if it weren't for Halo the X-Box might have tanked, joke or no joke it is sure to piss a few X-Box fanboys off huh??

[Sendok]

But why is it your favourite game of all time, don't say because it is fun, give me something solid so I can understand the mental state of mind you all have with this game, because all I can see is a generic FPS that offers no more then any first person shooter on the PC, but with worse controls.

While its not my favorite game of all time (to early to say that).

Why I like Halo 2:

- System Link
- I like the controls
- I like how it sounds
- I like how it plays
- I like all the wepons, seriously i love to use every one of them.
- Jacking vehicles is a blast when facing other people


lemme just also say this. I don't play PC games, i never got into it. I'm sure HL2 will be your "precious pet" when it arrives. but I will enjoy halo 2 instead.

----------

I have no doubt in my mind that without halo the XBox probably woulda tanked. have I enjoyed other games like: Panzer Dragoon Orta, JSRF, PGR 1 + 2, Ninja Gaiden etc etc etc....yes. However I wanted sega games like PDO, and JSFR so i woulda bought an XBox anyhow, but thats just me.


---------

Halo 2 hype. was there alot of it? Uh in a word yes. Wouldn't you expect it to have alot of hype? As Mach has so pointed out alot of people bought an XBox for halo. *and i mean a lot of people* So if you were MS or Bungie...wouldn't you create a "demand" for more info on the game durring development? Given Halo had always had its hype about it even when it was originally planned for the mac. But it is safe to say that Halo 2 did have alot of pre-launch hype.

You can blame that most on who? the gamers themselves. The media is around to serve consumers not the other way around. If people didn't watch shows like "Trading Spaces" or "Survivor" they would be canned so fucking quick you would never notice. However people do watch them, why I don't know but they do. If enough people are interested in something, guess what your gonna see it. Now you can say that lots of people are interested in other games like MP2, MK: DD, and others...but Nintendo plays the market differently. From what I see, Nintendo couldn't give a rats ass about magazine exlusives, or releasing tid bits at a time about their newest creations to keep people interested. Look at the e3 LoZ trailer. People still watch it...but since there is no new info you are not gonna see tons of writing on it.

---------

there you have my opinon.

[Greg]

While halo 2 is not my favorite game of all time but I do think that it is a fantastic FPS and heres why.

-Visually the game looks fantastic it has those few glitches at the start of a level but other then that it looks good.
-Story is very well done while the ending is kind of a let down it still is a great story and leaves you wanting more.
-I think it plays very well. I like the overall feel of the game and the controls. Dual weilding weapons is done very well and adds a lot to the game.
-Sounds great especially if you have dolby digital 5.1 surround but even without it it sounds great.
-Lastley the multiplayer is great whether its on line or system link it is a lot of fun to play and is keeps me coming back. Halo 2's multiplayer is one of the best I have ever played.

Shane I've never seen why you think HL2 will be so good. I've played the first one and I didn't even like it that much. Hell I never finished because I could of cared less about it. So I guess its all a difference in opinion about what you like. You apperantly don't like halo2 and I am not at all interested in HL2.

[HereticPB]

Graphics Whores.

Here is the Direct Path to Greatness in Halo and Halo2:

Shoot, dodge, shoot, run, use vehicle, shoot, run over, shoot, dismount, shoot, dodge, shoot, collect, shoot, finally dodge and shoot.



Yawn, do you have any racing games to play or something different this is boring?

[Sendok]

Graphics Whores.

Here is the Direct Path to Greatness in Halo and Halo2:

Shoot, dodge, shoot, run, use vehicle, shoot, run over, shoot, dismount, shoot, dodge, shoot, collect, shoot, finally dodge and shoot.



Yawn, do you have any racing games to play or something different this is boring?

You have a knack for this type of generalization don't you?

Lets also examine:

Goldeneye:

shoot, dodge, shoot, run, shoot, use a tank, shoot some more.

Or better yet...

Tony Hawk:

skate, do a trick, skate, fall, skate, do a trick...

Legend of Zelda:

run, hack, slash, push crate, run, run run, hack, shoot arrow, run, push crate...

Now see isn't this boring? but SNAP! this thread is supposed to be about hype! *slaps forehead*

[Griffin-Pierre]

The adverts make me feel warm inside. Like the Zelda trailer. Y'all (for one to a better phrase) need to chill the fuck out, and just enjoy games.

[goku2057]

Anyone read the article in the new EGM about how if it weren't for Halo the X-Box might have tanked, joke or no joke it is sure to piss a few X-Box fanboys off huh??


Which issue, and what page?

[ch33f]

Meh, fuck it, *presses ~* *types: "/quit"*.

[Colin™]

Which issue, and what page?


Most recent one, towards the front.

Its basically an article about a bunch of "what-ifs" in the gaming industry with answers by a bunch of different industry experts.

[HylianKWG]

^ Thank you for answering that because I wasn't going to be able to look at that issue until tommorrow night when I get back home.
:cheers:

[Dorbin]

I think that's what you'd call one of those exaggerations.

Haha, in all of your post, this line just popped out to me as I scrolled.

Nice Bush quote! haha...a pretty obscure one too.