Slavery

[Omega]

Has been a completely normal social facet throughout history. Even though America and many nations have abolished it from their societies is it really wrong? For many people, slavery was a way of life that sustained them in a lifestyle unattainable otherwise with provisions for shelter, food, clothing and even compensation. As with many things, only the few negative accounts of abuse and mistreatment surfaced as "common knowledge" to define slavery as an altogether bad idea.

I'm not saying I condone slavery just opening up a discussion.

[aerofan113]

What good things did slavery bring? I never tried to think of any positives.

[plebben]

If it wasnt for slavery society wouldnt be at the point it is today.
Theres nothing we can do to change that. Nor do i think anyone would want to either.

But Omega. Slavery throughout history is not about a few negative accounts of abuse and mistreatment. Maybe the slavery in america in the 1800s were(cause im not very familiar with the whole slavery issue in america during that time) but not in the history of the world.

Owning the right to someone elses LIFE... how could you possibly defend that? That is what slavery is all about. One human being OWNING other human lives with economical power and having unquestioned power to do what the hell you want with that humanbeings life.

I doubt you would stop questioning the "badness" of slavery if Michel Moore came home too your parents and gave them a shitload of money and made them sign a paper saying he owns your ass from now on and till the day you die.

Not a very appealing thought, is it?

[Omega]

My parents? Haha, I have my own home and family, big guy. But the way you describe slavery isn't to distant from the way people are owned today by financial debt, credit cards, their social class. In this life you're either an owner or you're owned whether you call it slavery or not.

[plebben]

difference is that you still have the freedom to say what you want.
Omega you were onace a child with one or two parents deciding over you. That was my point. and you know that.
So for instance, do you think your children would like it if you sold them to someone who would use them for costfree labour? Didnt think so either.


hmm.. well maybe i should clearify my self..
i just looked this up in the dictionary.
There are two different kind of slavery in swedish.. i see now in the dictionary that both kinds are called slave/slavery in english while in swedish we have SLAV and TRÄL.
Slav is a slave that has no rights what so ever and his master can abuse him and treat him anyway he wants or kill him. Without risking any punishment.
Träl is a slave that has rights. His master must provide food for him and he can not kill the "träl" without being forced to face punishment him self. However the träl is owned by his master and may not try to escape his master or his work or he can be sentenced to heavy physical punishment or death by the king/duke/etc. or ruler of the country/region.
My dictionary translated both Slav and Träl into Slave so i guess in english there are two different kinds of slaves/slavery... and i suppose youre reffering to the one i refer to as Träl in swedish.

[Omega]

Thats correct, very good homework on your part.

[Crow]

George Washington owned slaves and he's seen as a the father of America, when your feeding the slave and giving him home its a little different to when your abusing them, the 'slave' may have not had shelter before or food so for them its kind of a good thing. However there's not much chance of doing anything else for them, its not like they can get another job at the weekends.

[Travis]

I believe if we tried to have slaves in this day and age it would be wrong. Was it wrong in the past...putting myself in their time period, I probably would have owned slaves too. Looking back, it was wrong. For them, it was right.

[Crow]

I believe if we tried to have slaves in this day and age it would be wrong. Was it wrong in the past...putting myself in their time period, I probably would have owned slaves too. Looking back, it was wrong. For them, it was right.

go make me a sandwich yank or iyl kill you! j/k

you think you'd be a slave owner?

[Travis]

If I lived back when slavery was the way of life in the same place I live now?

Of course...I'm a white male living in North Carolina.

[The Dude]

I had a slave, I dressed him up like voldo.

I heard that there is still a black market for slaves.

[Omega]

I heard that there is still a black market for slaves.
Yea in some parts of the world.

[Crow]

Thailand, after many parents strapped their kids to tree's so they didn't get washed away by the Tsunami, they where taken away and sold as slaves

[Haver]

Wer'e all slaves.

[HereticPB]

The Afro American Slaves in America were slaves in africa to the tribal King which therefore sold his slaves to the white man.

Tell me that it is only the white man please try to tell me that.

[Viper]

My stance.


A slave has no choice. They are sold and traded like CD's. A slave exists to serve another without their consent. If it were consensual, then it's employment.

thee were also no laws protecting them from cruel and unusual punishment or harsh work coniditions. No medical, unemployment (in case they free them), no work rights, etc...

[aerofan113]

My parents? Haha, I have my own home and family, big guy. But the way you describe slavery isn't to distant from the way people are owned today by financial debt, credit cards, their social class. In this life you're either an owner or you're owned whether you call it slavery or not.


They made the chocie to be in debt and stuff. Slavery is forced, thats why its slavery.

[Mach]

The only thing I have to say is just look at the Chinese. They were enslaved for many many years when they came to America. They were beaten and treated horribly. But throughout history they have proven that they do not need a slanted ride, handouts, and special privileges because of the way they were treated to succeed. Nope. They've worked hard and they have achieved greatness. Their test scores, work ethic, and often leadership roles are known to surpass all other races in America.

[Sandman]

I think slavery is wrong in all forms.

However, the African American Rastafarians, Nation of Islam, etc. that think their people should go back to Africa for all of the harm caused to them are just being ridiculous. If their ancestors weren't slaves, they would probably be dead/dying of AIDS, starvation, civil wars, or some other problem that is occurring in Africa.

Now, I know that doesn't justify us taking them as slaves, but for them to want to go back is just retarded.

[Omega]

And they eat cat nuggets.

[brudaman]

Of course slavery is wrong in the year 2005, but back in early years of America it was widely accepted even by Thomas Jefferson and any other of the founding fathers give or take a few. Slavery was accepted then and was regular business no one would even raise a brow if they saw you whipping your slave over doing something wrong. Society has evolved, and so have human's as a species this is why slavery is no longer condoned for.

[Bloodman]

slavery is wrong. I believe you can only be a slave if you want to be one. Nobody should make anyone do that.

[The Dude]

Yea in some parts of the world.

I'm talking right here in america, NYC speciffically. I read it a few years ago that they lure in immigrants, mostly from asia, and make them "indentured servants"

[dork]

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part1/images/1plan0129b.jpg

Slavery is wrong.

[peasantlover]

My stance.


A slave has no choice. They are sold and traded like CD's. A slave exists to serve another without their consent. If it were consensual, then it's employment.

thee were also no laws protecting them from cruel and unusual punishment or harsh work coniditions. No medical, unemployment (in case they free them), no work rights, etc...

that's not really a stance, Viper, so much as a definition of slavery, heh.


There have some societies where slavery was beneficial to the common good or even the slaves, and some where the slaves deserved their rote, however, American society is\was not one of them, and slavery in America was a cruel evil.

[Viper]

I guess I agree with Webster then, hehe.

[peasantlover]

Of course slavery is wrong in the year 2005, but back in early years of America it was widely accepted even by Thomas Jefferson and any other of the founding fathers give or take a few. Slavery was accepted then and was regular business no one would even raise a brow if they saw you whipping your slave over doing something wrong. Society has evolved, and so have human's as a species this is why slavery is no longer condoned for.

no no no. It was not "accepted" by Thomas Jefferson or most of the founders, It was abhorred, especially by Jefferson. In the original draft of the Declaration of Independence, he wrote one of the major crimes of the British empire was instituting slavery in the colonies. The reason it was allowed was because the southern colonies, where slavery had taken root, were needed to fight the British and for the American nation to be successful.

[Bryan]

My parents? Haha, I have my own home and family, big guy. But the way you describe slavery isn't to distant from the way people are owned today by financial debt, credit cards, their social class. In this life you're either an owner or you're owned whether you call it slavery or not.

It isn't.. But that's an invisible slavery. Not being able to leave, to better yourself, and to think for yourself makes you a slave.

Whether it's the shackles on your legs and the lack of a right to vote is irrelevant. I see the slavery you speak of as more of an issue in modern society.

At least in the United States.

Still, I guess there are people in South East Asia and China that exploit children to make products that are shipped overseas (and run by American corporations) which is also a big problem.

I guess the only thing good about slavery is the lack of cost for slave owners. If you don't have to pay them anything, there is more profit. Haha, other than that though, it's pretty fucked.

[peasantlover]

yeah, people in credit card debt are slaves to the credit card companies.. sucks balls, but they got their through their own poor decisions.

credit card companies = evil, however

[Bryan]

If you're responsible with credit cards though, you can make the companies your bitch.

[peasantlover]

wow, I would sure like to know how to do that. can you teach me?

[Bryan]

Yeah, you bend Visa over a chair and ask it who it's daddy is..

But really, if you have a credit card, and checks.. What you can do is buy everything with the credit card, and pay it all off with one check as opposed to writing out a ton of checks, spending money on it, writing is hard, and the like.

Incoherent?

Maybe.

Unnecessary?

Of course!

But, I had to think of something, Dennis.

Or you can just steal a credit card...

[peasantlover]

that doesnt pwn the credit card companies, though. They still make money from the venders when the CC's are processed, and if you are accidently late they make money from you in interest. It's win-win for the credit cards, although they make more money when their customers get themselves horribly in debt.

[fourthdimension]

first off i dont agree with slavery but when u talk about credit card companies enslaving you thats not how it is when u take the credit card you take the responsibillity and if by chance you get into debt there is ways and steps to get you out of debt.

and as for slavery in the 1800's i dont agree with that but it happened for a reason
however apparent are disdained that reason is
1.it spread nationalitys through out the world leading to not only black people living in white communitys but also goods such as coffe granules and tea granules and all they other products made by the third world
2because of our mistake with slavery we now realese it is wrong

just like a duallity if your gonna know what good is u have to know how to bve bad first

not sure if that made sense but enuff said
peace all y'al

[alpha]

pmg, omega wants to know if he can hire them slaves for cleanign his housezor. j/k pwn.

Of course it's wrong or they wouldn't have created the underground railroad * jumps on train and goes to sEman's house*

[C~MONEY]

Fuck Slavery Im Glad Its Over

[Bryan]

Class inequality is slavery.

Edit: Or maybe more like imprisonment. Hmm..

[Michael]

From a person/racial standpoint, of course I'm opposed to slavery. Alot of the slavery I've seen before what happened in america seemed like indenture servitude, or limited slavery, not passed down to there children. However, I only looked at a small portion of this. Slavery as it stands, as a whole I think is wrong. People are literally being owned, they are property, it's not right.

[Bryan]

Yeah, when you can put people down as a bet on a poker game, something is definitely wrong with society.

[Omega]

Slavery is really only wrong if you're the slave. Think about that.

[Bryan]

No.. slavery is just wrong.

[Michael]

Well, since my ancestors were slaves, I don't see it like that Omega. If someone could be so cold as too treat people like babbles, either:
A. They have a problem
B. They think it's alright to do so which usually ends up being A.

[Bryan]

Thinking that's okay would be a problem..

[Omega]

You can't just equate slaves to blacks. There have been far worse enslaved people.

[Bryan]

In our country you can, though.

Also, just because blacks weren't the worst off, doesn't make it okay that they were slaves at one point.

Not that I think modern-day whites should be held responsible for it or something crazy. Still, it was a bad thing.

[Omega]

It was an opportunity for their children's children to become American citizens of today.

[Bryan]

It frightens me when you defend slavery, Omega. Haha..

[aerofan113]

I think maybee hes just putting a different spin on it.

[Omega]

Yeah I'm not saying I condone it in today's society this is just all philosophical/ethical chat.

[peasantlover]

You read any Aristotle Omega?

[plebben]

Aristotel was smart but an egotripped whacko also...
granted not may people has had such a widespread grasp of the collected knowledge of the known world as he had at that time...
He defended slavery pretty good too. As did Plato.

[brudaman]

no no no. It was not "accepted" by Thomas Jefferson or most of the founders, It was abhorred, especially by Jefferson. In the original draft of the Declaration of Independence, he wrote one of the major crimes of the British empire was instituting slavery in the colonies. The reason it was allowed was because the southern colonies, where slavery had taken root, were needed to fight the British and for the American nation to be successful.

If he abhorred it like you said then he definitely wouldn't have kept slaves. But he did.

[peasantlover]

Aristotel was smart but an egotripped whacko also...
granted not may people has had such a widespread grasp of the collected knowledge of the known world as he had at that time...
He defended slavery pretty good too. As did Plato.

yeah, he did have an ego, Aristotle. lol. But that was my point.

btw, where did Plato defend slavery? I dont remember that at all, and Ive read a lot of Plato.

Also, Aristotle didnt so much defend slavery.. he just argued that there were "natural slaves," ie people so incompetent at life they were meant to be slaves... so i guess you could say he defended slavery in some instances, but not in all\most.

[Lord Worm]

Yea in some parts of the world.

Like in America.

There is a black market slave trade in almost every country in the world, Canada and America included. The reason this problem doesn't get the full and proper attention it needs is because no country wants to come out and say, "We've got a black market for slaves".

That doesn't make a country look too good, especially the more "Socially Evolved" ones.

As a left-leaning godless commie bastard, the concept of slavery appals me (and I hope that it appals you) and the slave-owner is my enemy.

Is slavery wrong? Who am I to say? But I will oppose it just the same.

[Bryan]

It probably isn't as widespread here as it is in countries in the Middle East, Africa, and Asia..

[plebben]

yeah, he did have an ego, Aristotle. lol. But that was my point.

btw, where did Plato defend slavery? I dont remember that at all, and Ive read a lot of Plato.

Also, Aristotle didnt so much defend slavery.. he just argued that there were "natural slaves," ie people so incompetent at life they were meant to be slaves... so i guess you could say he defended slavery in some instances, but not in all\most.
I dont know if he defended slavery as much his hole society was built on philosophers being the rulers of the city(there were no nations at that time, city states only) together with the soldiers. Pholosophers deciding what to do and the soldiers making sure it all happened.
Merchants were to be under soldiers and philosophers but still citizens. Women and slaves were not citizens and did not have the right to vote. Howerver slaves were needed for a city's functioning labour.
Women could be philosophers though so theoretically Plato didnt mind having women in power. He argued they were potentially just as good intelectually as men when it came to planning and thinking.
Slaves on the otherhand could never rank up to become citizens. But they were, as I mentioned,neccesary.