Better Than Real?

[LaLiLuLeLo]

I'm putting this post up, hoping you guys will bite the hook. Who knows the graphical potential of PS3? Certainly SCE is still researching it themselves and nothing is set in stone. The PS3 will be able to produce unprecedented levels of realism for games, ofcourse, that's a given. The only question is how real? And say the next generation of consoles further 'blurs the line between reality and game.' Then, if not that generation, but the PS4 generation, we finally do reach the power to create realism in games. For the past 20 years that's what games have strived for. So then what? Once we reach that plateau where do we go? I think games are evolving in the same way art did a century ago. Painters painted realism, constantly finding new ways to improve on their methods. Then, the camera was invented and artists weren't needed to create realism anymore. So artist had to create something new, they didn't just stop painting and drawing. So the realism movement evolved into the impressionism movement of art. And artist began using their imaginations to create bizarre and unreal things. Is this where games are headed? Tell me what you think, please.

[imported_Anonymous]

Wow! I never looked at it that way... Awesome dude!!!! WURD TO YA MUTHA!!!!!!!!!

[Scott R. Mraz]

I'm putting this post up, hoping you guys will bite the hook. Who knows the graphical potential of PS3? Certainly SCE is still researching it themselves and nothing is set in stone. The PS3 will be able to produce unprecedented levels of realism for games, ofcourse, that's a given. The only question is how real? And say the next generation of consoles further 'blurs the line between reality and game.' Then, if not that generation, but the PS4 generation, we finally do reach the power to create realism in games. For the past 20 years that's what games have strived for. So then what? Once we reach that plateau where do we go? I think games are evolving in the same way art did a century ago. Painters painted realism, constantly finding new ways to improve on their methods. Then, the camera was invented and artists weren't needed to create realism anymore. So artist had to create something new, they didn't just stop painting and drawing. So the realism movement evolved into the impressionism movement of art. And artist began using their imaginations to create bizarre and unreal things. Is this where games are headed? Tell me what you think, please.

Very interesting topic. I wish I had time to convey all my insedus ideas. Hoever take a loot at movies, they have been striving for the same thing; realism. Once they came close to achieving it, the styles simply spanned into new areas and new content. Matrix is a perfect example of movies moving in a different "technical / point of view" to achieve new angles and insightes into the world being presented. I imagine games will follow the same route; interwieving new ideas, concepts, and more and more becoming an art form with a statement. I think games lend themselves to action, however, as MGS showed games can be a very powerful means of philosophy, something sorely lacking in todays culture.

Back to the point, games will continue to evovle and venture into new territories.

[SE3k]

sorry i forgot to log in

i think we are going to improve the physics. like beds bouncing down stair realisticly. water acting likke water. bullets bouncing randomly by a mathmatical calculation. that what i think they will try to do. or even make unreal thing become real (ie- aliens body parts and stuff, human eyes[HL2])

[NadimMad03]

Some people say that Realism is killing gaming becuz it makes all the games the same

[Omega Blue]

Some people say that Realism is killing gaming becuz it makes all the games the same

that comment comes out of lack of knowledge on why realism is important.ok Realism is what differs games. each deveopment team strives to reach a diffrent style of realism. there are many styles and pionts of view. without realism today gaming would be somewhat dull.the realer the game in all aspects the more interesting it becomes. you have to look at it in a technical piont of view and wanting to see how great,"great" can be.im not trying to make u feel bad but open ur mind and think of realism as a way of pushing the boundries in a game.once someone reaches that boundry then they start trying to find ways to push and work around thoses to go even farther.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

yeah, people see the world differently. So "real," as portrayed in games is always going to change. But once things are indistinguishable from the real thing, where do we go from there? I think games are going from there to have to distort reality as best as possible (impressionism, anyone?), and still creating interactive, entertaining content. Cel shading, and games like Killer 7, which take that a step further are kind of the infancy of this... At some point it's not gonna be about how many polygons can be pushed. Also, most games are about killing, fighting, or both. But it's getting harder and harder to make killing and fighting entertaining and engrossing, and what makes games really fun now, which is the point of games, I hope, are the things that games allow you to do besides fighting. A good example would be Beyond Good And Evil.

[Makaveli_786]

yeah, people see the world differently. So "real," as portrayed in games is always going to change. But once things are indistinguishable from the real thing, where do we go from there? I think games are going from there to have to distort reality as best as possible (impressionism, anyone?), and still creating interactive, entertaining content. Cel shading, and games like Killer 7, which take that a step further are kind of the infancy of this... At some point it's not gonna be about how many polygons can be pushed. Also, most games are about killing, fighting, or both. But it's getting harder and harder to make killing and fighting entertaining and engrossing, and what makes games really fun now, which is the point of games, I hope, are the things that games allow you to do besides fighting. A good example would be Beyond Good And Evil.

See the thing is a lot of people talk about how unimportant graphics are but as soon as they see GT4 or Unreal 3 screenshots theyr rolling over in excitement, graphics have a long way to go yet but the way technology is improving it wont be long before we hit a climax but from quotes gathered be Sony we can tell theyr already looking at other things to incorporate into games(talking about virtual reality, biotech and games reading your brainwaves) so graphics will come to an end but other things will be incorporated which will keep games getting better and better.

[slayerx]

Intresting topic you have to remmeber games are made up more than graphics when some people think or games becoming as you said true realistic games some think just graphically but there are things like physics AI music and more to make a game realistic.

As already said each games team will have a diffrent idea of true realisim and the perfect game etc and if it was reached then surely we would see developers then try to use this and incoporate new and more intense things in games to push the boundaries.

I think with the PS3 the same thing will happen which appears to happen to all the Playstation consoles, that is that the near the end of the life cycle they get the further boundries are pushed.

I mean when the PS2 was lauched you had SSX i great looking game compare it now to other games MGS and GT i know diffrent games but the console has progressed so much as the developers have learned more about it and come to grasp its power and try use it to its full potenial.

[KlawHammer]

I agree - as long as we strive for realism you can be sure we are on the right track. The Unreal (ironic isnt it?) Engine was one of the pioneers in FPS realism and tha has continued with the Unreal Warfare Engine and the upcoming Unreal 3 Engine.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

Yeah, by graphics, you include things like physics models....yeah, A.I. goes along with realism all together, eh? But I didn't just say graphics as far as visual content. I said, when games are indistinguishable from the real thing, which includes NPC behavior, expressions, car physics, hair movement, digital wind, and so on... But I digress. Once Gran Turismo really is the real driving simulator, which it's on the fast track to becoming...then what? They've alreay pushed the peripheral front with that kick ass 900 degree steering wheel... So...oh yeah...and it's really gonna come down to texture quality... as far as 3d models go. Resolution and what not...zzzzz.

[jaxmkii]

what thinkgs shold become.... the all encoumpasing game like the say you leave your house as a sim, you go to your car GT4 you go to the air port FS2004 fly to a famouse golf corse Tigerwoods 2004 than get drafted into a crazy war on mars Doom3 someday (i would call the game Life)
we will have the TEG (total experance game)

[Makaveli_786]

LOL that game would have a lot of licensing issues.

[ibrooklyn]

what thinkgs shold become.... the all encoumpasing game like the say you leave your house as a sim, you go to your car GT4 you go to the air port FS2004 fly to a famouse golf corse Tigerwoods 2004 than get drafted into a crazy war on mars Doom3 someday (i would call the game Life)
we will have the TEG (total experance game)

Lol....To tell you the truth it MIGHT be possible with ps3....heres how it would work:

Cyber World would be the 3D world.....and from cyber worlds you can go places to like golf court, which would be some GOLF game which you would buy in CYBER WORLD. Or you would go on a Race track where you would be able to pick which racing game you would like to play, or have payed for =F

Remember the said that they want to distribute games online?

[Ress Cor]

Once games reach total realism and we're all bored, Hollywood will start to dish out musicals again because killing is really getting BORING (I can't belive I just said that), but anyway once we get in a game what we get in real life, we will all forget about gaming and go outside and play nice games such as tennis and "beat your friends down with a bat" and soccer, and other really cool outdoor things.

P.S. When I have kids, there will be no tv or game console within 1000 miles.

[Makaveli_786]

The PS3 is based on grid computing so if say in 7 years we have 50MBPs connections and there are 100 million PS3's we have a 100 million teraflop network, not bad huh?

[ibrooklyn]

The PS3 is based on grid computing so if say in 7 years we have 50MBPs connections and there are 100 million PS3's we have a 100 million teraflop network, not bad huh?

yea but dont forget that not everyone is gonna go online

but then again maybe they will....as soon as internet prices drop and become more available for everyone then i guess everyone will be connected

[julps31]

I'm sure when games get photo realistic we'll still play them but like movies. You see a movie trailer that looks exciting and you buy the movie. You'll see a game that looks exciting and you'll buy it. It won't be about the graphics.

[ibrooklyn]

I'm sure when games get photo realistic we'll still play them but like movies. You see a movie trailer that looks exciting and you buy the movie. You'll see a game that looks exciting and you'll buy it. It won't be about the graphics.

ofcourse we will....games might get photo-realistic, but ideas NEVER die out. Imagine playing a game like that movie the MATRIX with photorealistic everything, from characters to cities to a superb AI

[julps31]

You won't notice how real it looks because we'll be used to graphics that good. So its the visually style and the special effects that would get you to play rather then how real it looks.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

Cyber world could just be faked with a 5 disc bd changer. haha. streamlining

[KlawHammer]

To be honest Hollywood is already starting to dish out rubbish. If you heard, recently, the movie business is losing to console gamers as most people would rather play games then watch a movie - why? Because in a game you control whats happening - in a movie its beyond your control.

[ibrooklyn]

To be honest Hollywood is already starting to dish out rubbish. If you heard, recently, the movie business is losing to console gamers as most people would rather play games then watch a movie - why? Because in a game you control whats happening - in a movie its beyond your control.

well its not just hat dude.......its also because hollywood is givin us shit

have you seen the HULK? DAREDEVIL? hell boy??? wtf are they thinkin

[KlawHammer]

I know, thats why i hope they dont make a mockery of the GTA and The Getaway movies...im crossing my fingers, if they make a fool out of the GTA brand then alot of gamers are gonna be armed with baseball bats ready to club the first celebrity they come across...

[ultimategamer2004]

Yes i sure hope they dont make a mockery of GTA they will never be forgived. And the GTA brand could be ruined and only people who have had the previous games would get it but everyone should have a GTA.

[Makaveli_786]

Man im putting all my trust in Sony telling Tristar to make a good GTA, if they dont then ill bomb hollywood, the Getaway is hard to cock up since slideshows of the game would make a good movie.

Im calling Quentin Tarantino right now, ive got my heart set on him directing the movies.

[ibrooklyn]

Man im putting all my trust in Sony telling Tristar to make a good GTA, if they dont then ill bomb hollywood, the Getaway is hard to cock up since slideshows of the game would make a good movie.

Im calling Quentin Tarantino right now, ive got my heart set on him directing the movies.

they arent even making a GTA movie =\

if any of you guys visited IGN you would have known that GTA Movie was only rumors and rockstar has confirmed that there arent any GTA movies in the making

[Makaveli_786]

Its inevitable to happen, GTA would sell like mad, do you think Rockstar wouldnt want to make a few hundred million off a movie and boost their game sales at the same time?

[KlawHammer]

Hell yea!
Quentin Tarantino is PERFECT for the job i tell you - it doesnt get better than that.

[Brad]

oh yea...pulp fiction meets metal gear solid baby

[ibrooklyn]

Its inevitable to happen, GTA would sell like mad, do you think Rockstar wouldnt want to make a few hundred million off a movie and boost their game sales at the same time?

hmm ofcourse they would, BUT i wouldnt go and watch another Scarface wanabe =\ in the game its cool but movies are a bit harder to make...tahts why u guys dont see MGS movies, because MGS is such a great game it would be a shame to make a movie that would suck. Same with GTA movie.

BTW as much as i like Tarantino......i think Guy Richie would be a better director for GTA type movie.

[Makaveli_786]

The reason you dont see movies made of games is because these people make games not movies, when you hire Hollywood to make a movie you have a dozen contracts to go through then a few hundred processes then wait 2 years for the movie to be made then hope its successful, most games have died down when a movie is released but with movies like GTA theyll be pretty damn alive for years to come so with them its different.

[ultimategamer2004]

Yes GTA does stay around for ages GTA3 is old and it is still 1 of the best games on ps2 and the GTA brand will be good for many years from now.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

Yeah...back to the topic! Start a new post for Game-movie conversions, I.E.: shit. And hey, I liked hulk and Hellboy! Them janks were great!

[stellan_sniper]

Always sceptic about these things, While chewing gum and smoking ciggarettes, I'd say that PS3 won't be "uber realistic" But i wil look good, and when I say good, I mean GOOOOOOD.. ehm.. anyway ..

Enviroments (needs 2 be hughe)
Particle fx
Weather fx (Haven't seen any game with good result)
Physics (ragdoll is kind of standard now let's evolve some more)
textures (photos)
models (more motion)

And don't forget the AI (HL2 is gonna be standard in 1½year or less)

all do exist in this time, we just need to make it better.

Whats my point......? None, I'm just bored to madness, and need coffee...

[the legendary ice man]

And don't forget the AI (HL2 is gonna be standard in 1½year or less)

Sadly, Doom 2 AI is more intelligent than that, Doom 2 uses a real-time AI script whereas HL2 follows a very big path script with only minor decisions.

Come to think of it, Doom 1 might have had it...

[LaLiLuLeLo]

The monsters in doom weren't shooting windows out when doors were baracaded. Path script or real time, what it all boils down to is what's happening on screen. If it's convincing, it doesn't matter what coding is used. They weren't talking about the impressive A.I. from Doom 2 back in the day, were they. No, sorry. What it boils down to is, if you're doing your job well, it doesn't matter how you're doing it. That's like memorizing lines for a play, or just reading a teleprompt. If you pull it off, what difference does it make? So yeah, HL2 is no slouch. Scalawag. Oh, and sniper, haven't seen good weather effects? Metal Gear Solid 2? Played it? It's like 8 dollars now. Take a look.

[Ragnorok]

In other cases lalil's logic :tounge twister: isnt always applicable, but in the sense of AI it really is about just whats happening not the 010's behind it.

[KlawHammer]

Enviroments (needs 2 be hughe)
Particle fx
Weather fx (Haven't seen any game with good result)
Physics (ragdoll is kind of standard now let's evolve some more)
textures (photos)
models (more motion)


mmm, about photos - seems games that use photos for textures always seem to flop it - you need a good "graphics accelerator"(sorry guys im an old skool 3dfx/voodoo fan).

Ragdoll physics - like Dave Mirra Freestyle BMX2 (some wierd trademark of a name i rmemeber it had the word "natural in it...anyway) are old i do agree with you.

Weather FX - you mean realtime weather fx right? if so GTA and the orignal Jak & Daxter had fairly decent ones - but yes not good results.

Models - most are as stiff as a flapost - only a few scripted motions - seems devs are getting lazy.

Environments - well we all want 'em bigger...

[ultimategamer2004]

perhaps we could have the hole country as an enviroment then eventually after years and years of playing it is 2050 and you know where everything is :lol:

then the next edidtion comes out :roll: