Next-gen DVD alliance drifting farther apart

[Domination]

TOKYO — Talks among Matsushita, Sony and Toshiba designed to unify competing next-generation DVD formats have failed, making it more likely the rivals will follow separate paths to the video market.
Backers of the rival HD DVD and Blu-ray Disc formats said talks would nevertheless continue.

The rivals met here Monday (May 16). A separate meeting of the Blu-ray Disc Association atttracted 230 attendees from 80 companies. The HD DVD Promotion Group held an extraordinary meeting that drew 120 attendees from 64 companies. Both meetings were closed to the public.

Sony and Toshiba updated the status of unification talks during both meetings, according to attendees. Kiyoshi Nishitani, Sony's senior vice president, acknowledged that the three companies had failed to reach an agreement, according to a Sony spokesman.

Meanwhile, Yoshihide Fujii, president and CEO of Toshiba Digital Media Network Co., confirmed that if the 0.1-mm disk format reaches satisfactory production and cost levels, unification based on the 0.1-mm cover layer was still possible. Still, industry sources said the format has yet to meet those requirements.

Toshiba executives said unification talks have been complicated by the assumption that a merger would be based on the 0.1-mm format. They insisted that the talks should discuss technologies used in both formats.

Both Sony and Toshiba executives said the talks would continue, but downplayed the prospects that the three consumer electronics giants could reach a consensus on a unified format.

The HD DVD group said it will stick to its schedule for introducing HD DVD products later this year.
Source (http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=YGGMSTYALYPYUQSNDBESK HA?articleID=163103901)

Either these guys are keeping lip tight on this secret of theirs or they really aren't interested in merging their formats. I go for the first. What ever the case, though, one of the two choices (rather merged or solo) is said to still be choosen for the console. Let's just hope it turns out well which ever it be.

[CrumCon]

Toshiba isnt that smart to me.

Blu-ray has been backed up by many giant companies around the world, much much more than HD-DVD.

It would be wise to talk to Sony again. or their HD-DVD project will be gone for nothing.

the hard works, the high cost, the pride for HD-DVD will be gone.. i dont think they want that.

--

[Gegenki]

I recognise Blu-Ray as the superior format when it comes to what I want from a CD and I want Blu-Ray to take off and for HD-DVD not to take off and then for toshiba to join Blu-Ray, but that looks unlikely with the head start HD-DVD is going to get.

[FerrianX]

Toshiba has got to be one of the most ill informed companies out there. Do they relize just how inferior their HD-DVD format is compared to BluRay? I can not see why they just can't settle with Sony and unify both formats, it's a win / win situation for them. They get their name on the better format and claim same profits.

I'm starting to feel Toshiba is letting their pride get in the way of closing this deal... fools

[the legendary ice man]

maybe, but when you consider HD-DVD is slowly having more layers built into it...it's obvious that an agreement isn't going to happen.

What would the agreement be anyway?

[Rallyracr420]

A separate meeting of the Blu-ray Disc Association atttracted 230 attendees from 80 companies. The HD DVD Promotion Group held an extraordinary meeting that drew 120 attendees from 64 companies.
Why was the HD-DVD meeting an extraoridnary meeting but the Blu-Ray meeting was not??

[Danji]

It was extraordinary based on their track record. :lol:

[FerrianX]

maybe, but when you consider HD-DVD is slowly having more layers built into it...it's obvious that an agreement isn't going to happen.

BluRay has already hit 8 layers with Sony's on protype format. So HD-DVD having another layer really isn't that significant.

Why was the HD-DVD meeting an extraoridnary meeting but the Blu-Ray meeting was not??

hehe you bring up a good point :) I'd chalk it up to some well done hype for now.

[Lumine]

Here's another article on it. Looks like Matasushita is on the Sony side for the most part.

The president of Matsushita told Toshiba to yield their position on a unified DVD format stating that Sony and Matsishita will not give in.

"The comments by Kunio Nakamura are the latest sign that negotiations between officials from Toshiba, which backs a new DVD technology called HD-DVD, and Sony and Matsushita, supporters of a rival format known as Blu-ray, have hit a snag.

Source (http://news.designtechnica.com/article7489.html)
Full Source (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050519/tc_nm/tech_dvd_dc)

[JetBlackRX89]

I have a feeling HD-DVD is going to basically die out if it doesn't unify in some sort of new format with Blu-Ray.

Well, in a way it's a very good thing. I had mixed feelings, torn between Blu-Ray's amazing storage and capabilities vrs the simple fact that HD-DVD would be less costly since it still uses dvd tech.

Sooner or later we'll have to adopt Blu-Ray. Just like sooner or later we'll all probably get HDTV. The sooner it's on the market, the sooner prices will fall as it gets more widely accepted. If everybody stuck to VHS and didn't decide to dig a little into their pockets for a DVD player, today DVD players would probably still be extemely expensive with only a few movies released on dvd.

PS3 will usher in Blu-Ray in America, and as people see what amazing things this new format is capable of, there will be an increasing demand for movies to be released in the format. Blu-Ray will become the standard. 2 years from now Blu-Ray players will be inexpensive and PCs will start featuring drives for them. You'll have kids burning PS3 games on blu-rays with new mod chips for ps3.

As for now, I think we should just go ahead and break the ice with the Blu-Ray format and stop wasting time trying to form any unified standard. Let a battle of survival of the fittest engage and see who wins.

As my history teacher Mr Buckley says, "The more things change, the more they stay the same." Everything you see people doing today will be done on Blu-Rays 2 or 3 years from now.

[Ibanez32]

Its VHS and betamax all over again which is also a classic example of how the superior format doesn't always win it all depends on which companies support and what people buy. the only thing hd-dvd has going for it is that it can be played in a standard dvd player.

[Lord Darkblade]

NO IT CANNOT

BLU-RAY = BLUE LASER
HD-DVD = BLUE LASER
DVD = RED LASER
CD = INFRARED LASER

HD-DVD needs a new head to be read, it needs to alter manufacturing facilities etc... the only difference is it costs less as the layers are in the same place as DVD ones.

HD-DVD is not backwards compatible out the box either, nor is Blu-Ray, both can use multiwavelength heads or multiple heads to achieve this though.

Sorry, but this misconception that HD-DVD is backwards compatible etc is so not right, where do people get it?

[Domination]

The both of them, Blu Ray and HD-DVD, are backwards compatible. Truth me when I tell you that. We at PSINext have been keeping up with this news for quite some time.

[Schmeh]

The both of them, Blu Ray and HD-DVD, are backwards compatible. Truth me when I tell you that. We at PSINext have been keeping up with this news for quite some time.

No they are not. Lord Darkblade is correct Blu Ray, HD-DVD use a completely different wavelength than DVD. Like he said you can use a multiwavelength head to read and write both, just like DVD and CD. Almost all Blu-Ray and HD-DVD devices (players and writers) will have multiwavelength heads since it is not they are not that expensive.

[Mordecai]

I think this is a case of bad wording... Both Blu-Ray and HD-DVD can play DVD and CD because both technologies will be incorporating multiple heads to do so. Neither technology can inherently play DVD's, but both can simply because the companies making the products decided to include the multiple heads for more functionality.

[the legendary ice man]

Tri-Laser isn't it?

[O.D.S]

heres some good news for a change (well sort of :? )

Toshiba sees eventual unified DVD format
Thu May 26, 2005 07:41 AM ET
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TOKYO (Reuters) - The president of Toshiba Corp. said on Thursday producers of the next generation of optical discs will eventually use one format, although products based on two competing standards may be around for a limited time...

...The head of Sony Corp's game unit seemed to agree with the idea that there will be two formats in the market, saying he planned to launch Sony's next-generation game console next spring based on its own optical disc standard...

...Ken Kutaragi, "The only hope is if we can reach an agreement in a week or two on a new format that is not that different from Blu-ray physically," Kutargi told reporters at a gathering of business executives when asked if there were still time to agree on a unified format and have that incorporated in the PlayStation 3...

..."We may actually have a situation where merchandise from both sides is put on store shelves. But the market would not allow that situation to last very long," Toshiba President Tadashi Okamura told Japanese business leaders.

The two sides have been engaged in a last-ditch effort to forge a common format, but no substantial progress has been made so far.

Both sides say that reaching a unified format would be ideal to avoid confusion and inconvenience, which occurred with the VHS-Beta battle over video tape formats two decades ago.

But the clock is ticking. Toshiba plans to launch HD DVD-based players by the end of 2005, and Sony plans to put a Blu-ray disc drive in its new PlayStation game console next year

for me right now i dont care what they use, as long as my PS3 isnt pushed back even more (i mean i do have to wait 6 months longer than most people because i live in Australia. :evil: )

[xbdestroya]

The both of them, Blu Ray and HD-DVD, are backwards compatible. Truth me when I tell you that. We at PSINext have been keeping up with this news for quite some time.

No they are not. Lord Darkblade is correct Blu Ray, HD-DVD use a completely different wavelength than DVD. Like he said you can use a multiwavelength head to read and write both, just like DVD and CD. Almost all Blu-Ray and HD-DVD devices (players and writers) will have multiwavelength heads since it is not they are not that expensive.

Everyone's right, and everyone's wrong. :wink:

It's true players with multi-read heads would be able to play standard DVDs, but indeed the technology does exist for both camps to put a standard DVD layer on the blue layer discs that would be able to be read in standard DVD players. The idea being, you buy a movie with both HD and regular versions on it (blue-laser format + red-laser format), and you can watch it on your DVD player but then also use the same disc to watch the HD version when you eventually upgrade.

[xbdestroya]

heres some good news for a change (well sort of :? )

Toshiba sees eventual unified DVD format
Thu May 26, 2005 07:41 AM ET
Printer Friendly | Email Article | Reprints

TOKYO (Reuters) - The president of Toshiba Corp. said on Thursday producers of the next generation of optical discs will eventually use one format, although products based on two competing standards may be around for a limited time...

...The head of Sony Corp's game unit seemed to agree with the idea that there will be two formats in the market, saying he planned to launch Sony's next-generation game console next spring based on its own optical disc standard...

...Ken Kutaragi, "The only hope is if we can reach an agreement in a week or two on a new format that is not that different from Blu-ray physically," Kutargi told reporters at a gathering of business executives when asked if there were still time to agree on a unified format and have that incorporated in the PlayStation 3...

..."We may actually have a situation where merchandise from both sides is put on store shelves. But the market would not allow that situation to last very long," Toshiba President Tadashi Okamura told Japanese business leaders.

The two sides have been engaged in a last-ditch effort to forge a common format, but no substantial progress has been made so far.

Both sides say that reaching a unified format would be ideal to avoid confusion and inconvenience, which occurred with the VHS-Beta battle over video tape formats two decades ago.

But the clock is ticking. Toshiba plans to launch HD DVD-based players by the end of 2005, and Sony plans to put a Blu-ray disc drive in its new PlayStation game console next year

for me right now i dont care what they use, as long as my PS3 isnt pushed back even more (i mean i do have to wait 6 months longer than most people because i live in Australia. :evil: )

I can't believe the drama continues! :shock:

Well, Kutagari better call HQ up and tell them to get this thing settled with Toshiba in the next two weeks. :wink:

Playing next-gen video content was going to be a big plus for me!

[Ibanez32]

So can someone explain to me what advantages of hd-dvd are besides being a bit cheaper whats the motivation for companies to want to choose it ?

[FerrianX]

So can someone explain to me what advantages of hd-dvd are besides being a bit cheaper whats the motivation for companies to want to choose it ?

Other then lower manufacturing costs there are no advantages which HD-DVD has over Blu-Ray.

Actually I think HD-DVD might have better compression methods... need to research that again...

[theFUTURE]

Personally, if the PS3 gets pushed back by a couple of months because of this, that would be fine by me. I was also hoping for a next-gen video format on the PS3. I wouldnt want to buy two separate players for playing video games and watching movies. That was one of the reasons i bought the PS2 to begin with. I hope they find a way to merge the two formats quickly or at least agree on one side to back. PS3 by next holiday season isnt that bad, is it? At least you'll get a better system overall.

[mckmas8808]

Other then lower manufacturing costs there are no advantages which HD-DVD has over Blu-Ray.

No actually HD-DVD does not have that advantage anymore. The Blu-ray Association has just released new news today. Read below.

More capacity, same price. The Blu-ray Disc Association said today that the long-term cost of manufacturing BD-ROM discs with capacities of will be in line with current DVD replication costs. 25 and 50 GByte media will become available this year, BD discs with up to 200 GByte are currently completing lab testing.

The cost to commercialize a new technology often decides over success or failure of a new product. The Blu-ray Disc Association appears to have made a significant step into a direction that will offer more than five times the storage space of today's DL DVD media on and keep manufacturing cost at about the same level. The organization today said that multiple companies involved with each step have contributed to process improvements and cost efficiencies.


"There are a lot of companies trying to stake out a position in various aspects of BD-ROM manufacturing," said Kazuhiro Tsuga, executive officer of Matsushita Electric. "As a result, we are seeing multitudes of improvements in processes and technology, as well as the effects of economies of scale that make replication extremely cost effective."


According to the Blu-ray Disc Association, the most recent advances have happened in the area of cover-layer technology, where one of two approaches, film bonding and spin coating, can be used to apply the 0.1 mm cover-layer used for Blu-ray discs.

The spin-coating process uses resin to form the cover-layer and is currently being piloted in Torrance, California by Panasonic.

Competition in film bonding, which is based on extruded film technology, apparently also has resulted in innovation and reduced manufacturing cost. A new film product from Teijin reduces the cost of the cover film to one-third of the cost of conventional polycarbonate materials. Germany-based Degussa believes that Blu-ray discs will be able to be mass-produced in the single-digit Euro cents range at launch. Production yields are expected to exceed 90 percent.

Commercial mass production of Blu-ray media will begin after the completion of pilot production in July of this year. Initial production will include 25 GByte and 50 GByte media with tests of 200 GByte discs already being completed in labs, the Blu-ray Disc Association said. Availability of such capacities will be offered "depending on needs," the organization said.

Link http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050525_144443.html

[O.D.S]

great find there mckmas8808,

finally some good news for BD and ultimatly for PS3!

Because costs will be brought down will this somehoew effect the price of BD players (such as PS3)?

[n1n9tean]

Bang, stab, slash, scratch, kaboom.....DEAD! (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/06/09/news_6127225.html)

[Metal Sphere]

I saw this one coming from a mile away. Sony, Matsushita and many others know that Blu-Ray's apparent "faults" when compared to HD-DVD can be ironed out easily. Also, it's the superior format and with a much greater flexibility/range than HD-DVD.

Toshiba's going to get dragged by the hair all over the place by the Trojan horse that is the PS3 and it's Blu-Ray playback. And major PC makers are already on board for Blu-Ray, so Microsoft will eventually have to support "the enemy".

[Viper]

Sony, Matsushita and many others know that Blu-Ray's apparent "faults" when compared to HD-DVD can be ironed out easily. Making Blu-Ray production cheap is not an 'easy' thing to do. HD-DVD is cheap because it uses current equipment to make. Also, the major movie studios have agreed that HD-DVD's 30 GB is enough. What does this all mean? Train wreck and we're the passengers.

[Metal Sphere]

Sony, Matsushita and many others know that Blu-Ray's apparent "faults" when compared to HD-DVD can be ironed out easily. Making Blu-Ray production cheap is not an 'easy' thing to do. HD-DVD is cheap because it uses current equipment to make. Also, the major movie studios have agreed that HD-DVD's 30 GB is enough. What does this all mean? Train wreck and we're the passengers.

Actually it is.. With the penetration of about 70-90 million Blu-Ray capable PS3s into the public and the release of Blu-Ray movies, this will all but negate the "cost" of updating facilities to pump out movies on the Blu-Ray format. People will have the means to watch the new type of movies, and with Blu-Ray PC drives, it'll only be a matter of time (and not that long either) before whatever price difference is erased.

It wouldn't surprise me if they sold them at current DVD prices in order to get people to buy them. And Hollywood, along with most folks, try to fit future technologies into the present, when you're supposed to look ahead. CD-ROMs quickly became "not enough" even though folks said that 700MB was more than enough. Blu-Ray's ability to go up to 800 GB on a single disc will ensure that another format change won't be in order for a long time.

[xbdestroya]

Well whatever the case, the format war seems to be in full effect once again - so in that vein, go blu-ray! 8)

[Viper]

Sony, Matsushita and many others know that Blu-Ray's apparent "faults" when compared to HD-DVD can be ironed out easily. Making Blu-Ray production cheap is not an 'easy' thing to do. HD-DVD is cheap because it uses current equipment to make. Also, the major movie studios have agreed that HD-DVD's 30 GB is enough. What does this all mean? Train wreck and we're the passengers.

Actually it is.. With the penetration of about 70-90 million Blu-Ray capable PS3s into the public and the release of Blu-Ray movies, this will all but negate the "cost" of updating facilities to pump out movies on the Blu-Ray format. People will have the means to watch the new type of movies, and with Blu-Ray PC drives, it'll only be a matter of time (and not that long either) before whatever price difference is erased.

It wouldn't surprise me if they sold them at current DVD prices in order to get people to buy them. And Hollywood, along with most folks, try to fit future technologies into the present, when you're supposed to look ahead. CD-ROMs quickly became "not enough" even though folks said that 700MB was more than enough. Blu-Ray's ability to go up to 800 GB on a single disc will ensure that another format change won't be in order for a long time.

70-90 million? Sounds as though you automatically expect them to have that many in homes at launch. You must think of initial costs, not 5 years down the road. No one but MS takes losses for that long and lives to tell about it.

700 MB CD's are good for their intended use, audio.

The 800 GB discs are Iomega Corporation DVD, not Blu Ray, and uses current DVD technology to do.

[Lumine]

Why can't a reader read both blu-ray and hd-dvd. They both use the same wavelength (source (http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/#3.2)) Does it then have something to do with the numerical aperture and depth of the protection layer?

[Viper]

The discs are designed differently but there probably will be players that read both just like there are players that read both DVD and Divx.

[gablar16]

This whole issue doesn't seem right to me. Why any of this corpoartions care abou t technology? The answer is they dont. Like any corporation they only care about one thing. Profits. The whole thing is about royalties. Sony knows they have the better products and the way to deliver it to the consumers( PS3). Toshiba even tho they have the inferior produt, they want their R&D money back and maybe even some profits.

The way I see it Toshiba knows that Sony is going all in with BD and PS3 so they are bluffing. They are threating sony. If sony don't make so that Toshiba can make some money too , toshiba will go ahead and make life for sony very difficult and make it much less profitable for them, and maybe even the risk of losing the format war. Toshiba knows that their chances are low but they definitly have a hand to play and they will play it.

[Metal Sphere]

70-90 million? Sounds as though you automatically expect them to have that many in homes at launch. You must think of initial costs, not 5 years down the road. No one but MS takes losses for that long and lives to tell about it.

700 MB CD's are good for their intended use, audio.

The 800 GB discs are Iomega Corporation DVD, not Blu Ray, and uses current DVD technology to do.

The market share between the three consoles won't change much this generation, that much is certain. You can expect at least 60 million PS3s to be sold if the past two generations were anything to go by. That's still an incredible amount of cheap Blu-Ray players introduced in 5 years, and coupled with the standalone players, will quickly lead to Blu-Ray becoming standard. So it's not automatic, I'm basing it on the Playstation's last two generations.

Remember, Blu-Ray isn't just Sony just as Cell isn't a Sony-only endeavour. Members of the BDA will likely split the initial losses (which are expected to be higher than HD-DVD) but it won't take long to drop, and they'll be willing to take the losses collectively. You know folks often use CDs for other than their intended use, and while it was initially audio, what about the ability to store data on them without audio? That's also it's "intended" use and it's quickly becoming inadequate. People say that kind of stuff when they don't want to switch formats, even though the technology around them is there and the space needed is eclipsing CDs.

Don't know if you heard about it, but Blu-Ray's maximum capacity is 800 GB, this was mentioned in quite a few articles when Blu-Ray was first launched. As you can see, everytime HD-DVD gets some extra space squeezed out of it, Blu-Ray easily trumps it with 200 GB discs finishing testing. If Hollywood, the gaming industry, and anyone else is serious about expanding into high definition, they have to plan ahead. Adopting a constrained format like HD-DVD will lead to ANOTHER switch far sooner than taking on Blu-Ray. Resolutions are slowly rising and so are the demands on capacity, something Blu-Ray discs have down pat.

[xbdestroya]

Don't know if you heard about it, but Blu-Ray's maximum capacity is 800 GB, this was mentioned in quite a few articles when Blu-Ray was first launched. As you can see, everytime HD-DVD gets some extra space squeezed out of it, Blu-Ray easily trumps it with 200 GB discs finishing testing. If Hollywood, the gaming industry, and anyone else is serious about expanding into high definition, they have to plan ahead. Adopting a constrained format like HD-DVD will lead to ANOTHER switch far sooner than taking on Blu-Ray. Resolutions are slowly rising and so are the demands on capacity, something Blu-Ray discs have down pat.

Metal Sphere where did you get this 800GB number from? As far as I am aware, blu-ray is set to max out at 200GB for an eight-layer disc.

[Viper]

I just told you, the 800 GB disc is Ioemga Corp, not Blu-Ray.


http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=800GB+blu+ray&btnG=Google+Search

[mckmas8808]

Pioneer and Mitsubishi Chemicals announced today that they jointly managed to lower manufacturing cost of Blu-Ray Recordable discs (BD-R), by using the spin coating manufacturing technology.

There are two approaches in the area of cover-layer technology. Both film bonding and spin coating can be used to apply the 0.1mm cover-layer used in Blu-ray Disc. Today, Pioneer and Mitsubishi announced that by choosing the spin coating technology, in order to apply the organic dye material to the disc, the manufacturing cost is reduced to one-ninth, compared to the previous techniques. Spin coating technology is already widely applicable in the DVD-R manufacturing plants.

The prototype disc (write-once) offers a capacity of 25GB. A newly developed organic dye material is applied onto the disc base (polycarbonate) by using the spin coating technology. According to Pioneer, the first measurements during the disc playback are very good. The jitter value is 6.0% and the reflectance is 40%, which is almost the same as in the case of the DB-ROM disc.

Pioneer claims that the spin coating technology can be easily implemented by disc manufacturers and does not require large scale investments.

This announcement comes just one day after the one made by Hitachi-Maxell, regarding the development of the HD-DVD recordable disc.

[Viper]

That's great for the 25GB disc but Sony is touting their 50GB disc to everyone. If they only wanted 25GB, they would opt for the 30GB HD-DVD and still be slightly cheaper.


If Sony can get the cost down on the 50GB disc, then they'll definetly have something.

[Metal Sphere]

I just told you, the 800 GB disc is Ioemga Corp, not Blu-Ray.


http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=800GB+blu+ray&btnG=Google+Search

Ah, then I'm mistaken. However, I doubt Iomega's format will take hold since there's another format that popped up with capacity on the order of terabytes of capacity. Insane, and currently a pipe dream.

Like I said before Viper, Sony's probably going to eat the cost for the 50GB discs, since the 25GB babies aren't a good matchup to HD-DVD's 45GB.

[Lumine]

The discs are designed differently but there probably will be players that read both just like there are players that read both DVD and Divx.

My question is what is it about these two discs makes it so a single laser head can read only one? Other than that its just software, right? The DVD vs. DIVX was a software thing, if I recall correctly.

[Ice Phoenix]

I'm not much of a techy with lots of numbers up my sleave, but as an average (I would like to think smarter) consumer though. How much time does HD-DVD have on BD? A year? Less? Think back to the begining of DVD, when it first came about it was slow goin, Rental places such as Blockbuster had a very small section for quite awhile. Some people went out and bought a DVD player but for the most part it was a slow start. Then PS2 came about as the first game/DVD player. I'm sure many would agree that was the time DVD took off. With HD-DVD People are going to have to buy another machine. Regardless of your stance on the consoles we can be pretty positive that when the PS3 hits the stands around a million (more or less) are going to be sold. Instant game/BD player, most consumers will think, "Hey this thing plays the BD movies, so at blockbuster they will be looking and asking for BD movies. HD-DVD does not have that instant in the home advantage. Obviously this is what I forsee and is my own opinion. So technically/moneterially supior or not BD has very huge advantages over HD-DVD in becoming the new standard. Now if MS takes HD-DVD it would change things significantly, as of now they are MIA. I for one would also like to to see BD succeed becuase I am getting a PS3 and would like to have only one machine, becuase of money and space. I myself would not be excited in having to buy a new machine for movies :? I hope this makes sence, its speculation and my opinion based on previous events.

[Viper]

Ice Phoenix, unless you have an HD TV, you won't need Blu Ray or HD DVD movies since that is the purpose of the higher capacity dics. DVD's will still be made for every movie.

The same could easily happen if Xbox 360 uses HD DVD as it will have a fairly large userbase of upwards of almost 2 million worldwide by the time the PS3 launches.

Again, keep in mind, Blu Ray and HD DVD won't be that much of a use to any consumer unles they have an HD TV. As for Blu Ray movies on the PS3, same thing. You won't get anything a regular DVD player and movie can't give you unless you have an HD TV.

Recorders are a different matter because you can record any resolution you want.

[Ice Phoenix]

Ice Phoenix, unless you have an HD TV, you won't need Blu Ray or HD DVD movies since that is the purpose of the higher capacity dics. DVD's will still be made for every movie.

The same could easily happen if Xbox 360 uses HD DVD as it will have a fairly large userbase of upwards of almost 2 million worldwide by the time the PS3 launches.

Again, keep in mind, Blu Ray and HD DVD won't be that much of a use to any consumer unles they have an HD TV. As for Blu Ray movies on the PS3, same thing. You won't get anything a regular DVD player and movie can't give you unless you have an HD TV.

Recorders are a different matter because you can record any resolution you want.

I agree that if MS does go with HD-DVD it could happen there, but as of now, at least of what I'm aware of MS hasn't chosen a HD format for the drive yet, I thought I mentioned that in a way, and I do have a HDTV :D I'm not gonna upgrade my collection of DVD's but will start to get new movies that come out on the HD format. MS is kind of the catalyst at the moment, by their decision to support one or the other, since they are coming out 6 months ahead, I wouldn't underestimate the eventual Sony user base though either, it could over take the MS user base, I believe that if MS gets on the BD, its in the bag, if not then its up to see how strong Sony comes through. Because in the end whatever player is in the most homes will win. They both wil be equiped to play DVD's so its kind of a mute point there. My thoughts are not on the BD and HD-DVD's performance, rather on which will be in the most homes eventually :D Plus more and more HDTV's are being bought as the price comes down. maybe not in a year or two but in the next 5 for sure HDTV will be pretty standard, so BD or HD-DVD will have to be utilized then :wink:

The reason I'm focusing on the consoles so much instead of roms for computers or actual players is because I believe with these consoles one or the other will be ushered in. Oh and when they do eventually get a HDTV, BOOM! they have something to play their HD movies!