A graphical comparison between DOA3 and DOA4

[axia777]

I was watching a trailer to DOA4 on gametrailers.com and I was tsruck by how unimpressed I was by the gameplay graphics. Is that supposed to be next-gen graphics? Team Ninja is reputed to be one of the best X-Box game making studios, right? Then why does DOA4 only look a little better than DOA3?

A video of DOA3:

http://gametrailers.com/player.php?ps=1&id=882&type=mov

A video of DOA4:

http://gametrailers.com/player.php?ps=1&id=8312&type=mov

I like live moving video to compare graphics, not still shots. So who thinks that DOA4 looks negligibly better than DOA3? If this is what 360 is producing then I am not imoressed yet by it's graphical capabilities. Some one should work harder at using the hardware better or 360 is in trouble graphics wise.

[dementia]

DOAU engine = Xbox1-caliber visuals.

It's not Microsoft's fault for having weak hardware at all. It's Tecmo trying to cash in with a cheap and easy new game based on an old engine that doesn't even support normal maps.

[speed stick]

^Exactly. They just want to get their game out the door ASAP to make profits.

[axia777]

So DOA 4 does not even use a new graphics engine? That is crap and I just lost respect for Team Ninja. That is just plain old LAZY. It is embarrising for a launch game. Microsoft should have forbidden them to use old stuff and demanded that they use only new code so the game would look it's best. How lame. That also expalins a lot about the graphics being crap, polished crap, but crap next to real next gen graphics.

[speed stick]

^I think it might have been a different engine because the games have to have 720p and 4xAA support. But like you said, this is an embarrasing game.

[venomv]

This was my first though after seeing a trailer for DOA4. "What the heck, that looks almost exactly like DOA3, well with better hair animation" I wasn't able to play those videos, my browser chrashes when I try to open them, but if they look they same its a pathetic looking game.

[D3adcell]

So DOA 4 does not even use a new graphics engine? That is crap and I just lost respect for Team Ninja. That is just plain old LAZY. It is embarrising for a launch game. Microsoft should have forbidden them to use old stuff and demanded that they use only new code so the game would look it's best. How lame. That also expalins a lot about the graphics being crap, polished crap, but crap next to real next gen graphics.

Well in my opinion DOA isn't a very good game to begin with. Maybe thats just becuase i'm not big on fighters. But I think the forcing companies to meet a certain standard in graphics is a little insane, that is when smaller devs focus most of their time on making the game look good instead of play well. What abou 2d games aswell. Sony likes to limit what games can be on their systems just from graphics.

I got to thinking about this after reading an interview in EGM with the creator of castlevania DS

EGM: Well, you have two years until the 10th anniversary of Symphony of the Night. That way, you can make the ultimate version of that for PSP with all-new voiceovers.

IGA: Do you think Sony concept approval would let us? I doubt it.


So even though that sotn was a bad ass game, better then any 3d castlevania, and really fun to play, still selling well might i add. Sony has such tight restrictions that they probably would not let him do that. That is also a major reason why Metal Slug 3 came out on xbox and not ps2, also why Viewtiful Joe didn't come out on ps2 until scea saw how well it sold and its ratings on the gamecube.

So i'll end with this. A game should not be judged on its graphics, but rather the level of enjoyment you recieve while playing it.

[Z]

the background look a little better, but that may fall into the expected update of a new installment, but yes, DoA4 is one of the worst looking games on X2. still, anything is better than PDZ.

unimpressive graphics for X2 is due for the fact that ALL the games announced till now are current gen ported to X2 (PGR3 'may' be excluded). that is why some say wait till the next wave of games to see the true power pf X2. but by that time PS3 will be out for months...

[Glacier]

Microsoft has disclosed that the first generation of Xbox 360 games will be single threaded, despite the console’s multicore architecture.

The Inquirer was present at a recent lecture on multithreading at the Fall Processor Forum, and has reported that Microsoft, after using the Xbox 360’s three core, two thread per core architecture as an example in their presentation, went on to say that all first-generation Xbox 360 games would be single threaded.

Part of the reason for this may lie in the software development community’s apparent lack of experience with multithreaded programming.

In another lecture at the Fall Processor Forum, Microsoft software architect Herb Sutter stated that, to date, many application developers had been developing single threaded applications exclusively, and may be finding the switch to multithreaded programming somewhat challenging.

Historically, first-generation games for any new console don’t fully utilize the console’s improved hardware and processing power.

Although demos of Xbox 360 launch titles have impressed many, gamers can expect more “next-gen” looking titles from the second generation of Xbox 360 games and beyond, as developers become better acquainted with the subtleties of programming for the new console.
http://www.xb360info.com/xbox/news/201#more-201

[venomv]

I think them been single-threaded was a given, enough people are complaining about not know multi-thread programming. If the first games accualy used the CPU's(PS3 included) multi-threading, then all the whinning was crap but I think the devs are telling the truth to an extent

[r33hash]

Yeah, its retarded. They simply want a launch game, because launch games always sell well.

Thats why they threw Master Chief into the mix as well. No Halo launch title? Instead, they give us a smidgin of next gen Master Chief, rapped into another game altogether.

Its all about marketing. DOA will still be fun, but it should definitely be more impressive than it is.

[axia777]

Well in my opinion DOA isn't a very good game to begin with. Maybe thats just becuase i'm not big on fighters. But I think the forcing companies to meet a certain standard in graphics is a little insane, that is when smaller devs focus most of their time on making the game look good instead of play well. What abou 2d games aswell. Sony likes to limit what games can be on their systems just from graphics.

I got to thinking about this after reading an interview in EGM with the creator of castlevania DS



So even though that sotn was a bad ass game, better then any 3d castlevania, and really fun to play, still selling well might i add. Sony has such tight restrictions that they probably would not let him do that. That is also a major reason why Metal Slug 3 came out on xbox and not ps2, also why Viewtiful Joe didn't come out on ps2 until scea saw how well it sold and its ratings on the gamecube.

So i'll end with this. A game should not be judged on its graphics, but rather the level of enjoyment you recieve while playing it.

While I do agree with you on the subject of graphics vs fun, I am want to point out all the major smack talking Allard and Gates have been laying down. Now if all their hype of the "HD Era" had not been so loud I would forgive them somewhat for current gen looking next-gen games. But, loud about it they have been and that makes me laugh when they even mention "HD Era" games. No next gen DVD and current gen looking games equals a very embarrassing situation. They batter pick it up because from what MGS4 looks like in REAL TIME game play graphics, PS3 is gonna eat 360 for lunch.

[MicVlaD]

First of all: that "new" DOA 4 movie has been recorded from an early build. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it was the same build they used for the E3 2005 trailer. Several graphic effects are missing in this new trailer.

Secondly: DOA 4 isn't embarrassing. Sure, Team Ninja hasn't made a quantam leap like they did with DOA 2 -> DOA 3, but the game looks obviously better than DOA3 / Ultimate from what I've seen. Also, if you truly want to see an embarrassing looking next-gen game (and I'm sure I might've forgotten some):

GUN
Tony Hawk's American Wasteland,
Top Spin 2
Test Drive: Unlimited
Frame City Killer
Over-G: Energy Airforce / World Air Force
Amped 3
Tiger Woods 360
NHL 2K6
Rumble Roses XX
Far East of Eden
@Glacier: not all first generation Xbox 360 games are single-threaded, such as Condemned.

@r33hash: Halo 3 at launch would be too early and you know it.


Just to set things straight: I'm no DOA "fanboy" (yes, the series is fun, but also incredibly shallow when compared to fighters like Virtua Fighter 4 and GGX2), but saying DOA 4 looks like shit is an exaggeration, especially when you compare it with the games I summed up in the list above.

[axia777]

First of all: that "new" DOA 4 movie has been recorded from an early build. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it was the same build they used for the E3 2005 trailer. Several graphic effects are missing in this new trailer.

Secondly: DOA 4 isn't embarrassing. Sure, Team Ninja hasn't made a quantam leap like they did with DOA 2 -> DOA 3, but the game looks obviously better than DOA3 / Ultimate from what I've seen. Also, if you truly want to see an embarrassing looking next-gen game (and I'm sure I might've forgotten some):

GUN
Tony Hawk's American Wasteland,
Top Spin 2
Test Drive: Unlimited
Frame City Killer
Over-G: Energy Airforce / World Air Force
Amped 3
Tiger Woods 360
NHL 2K6
Rumble Roses XX
Far East of Eden
@Glacier: not all first generation Xbox 360 games are single-threaded, such as Condemned.

@r33hash: Halo 3 at launch would be too early and you know it.


Just to set things straight: I'm no DOA "fanboy" (yes, the series is fun, but also incredibly shallow when compared to fighters like Virtua Fighter 4 and GGX2), but saying DOA 4 looks like shit is an exaggeration, especially when you compare it with the games I summed up in the list above.


I personally did not say it look like shit. I said it look current gen with some extra polish. My point was that for the supposed "HD Era” Microsoft and their devs better pick is up quick style. MGS4 is in real time graphics. It eats everything I've seen on 360 for lunch. Team Ninja made some of the best looking graphics on Xbox. Ninja Gaiden kicked ass graphically, not to mention game play wise as well. But for a 360 game coming from Team Ninja I expected more. Xenos is supposed to kick ass. They have a triple core processor. DOA4 should look better on a next gen system.

[Z]

using only one core isn't news, so does many PS3 projects having to use only the PPE. but again, such poor looking titles are uneceptable to be labeled 'next-gen'. we are currently seeing may, many PC games that look much better than X2 games. you may argue that the games are still 'fun' to play, but at this stage, that isn't really enough since you can get nearly all those games on PCs and current gen. people need a reason to make a small investment and I want to see what I payed $400 for.
if they say the next wave will be impressive, then I'll be waiting. in the mean time, why rush if you aren't sold? haste makes waste, and better safe than sorry.
also, a not so impressive b/c support sure doesn't help the transition.