PS3 Blu-Ray Drive speed (6X/324Mbps)?

[Nameless]

I will start with this caveat, "The article listed is translated from German as a result perhaps the numbers listed are inacurate..." http://www.nexgam.de/?show=news&newsdetail=8713
(Use google to translate this article I could not get the translated link to format properly on this post...)

The transfer rate of the Blu Ray Disc (6x) is with 324Mb/sek - thus are the load times are kept very short.

According to the Blu-ray Disc specification, 1x speed is defined as 36Mbps. However, as BD-ROM movies will require a 54Mbps data transfer rate the minimum speed we're expecting to see is 2x (72Mbps). Blu-ray also has the potential for much higher speeds, as a result of the larger numerical aperture (NA) adopted by Blu-ray Disc. The large NA value effectively means that Blu-ray will require less recording power and lower disc rotation speed than DVD and HD-DVD to achieve the same data transfer rate. While the media itself limited the recording speed in the past, the only limiting factor for Blu-ray is the capacity of the hardware. If we assume a maximum disc rotation speed of 10,000 RPM, then 12x at the outer diameter should be possible (about 400Mbps). This is why the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) already has plans to raise the speed to 8x (288Mbps) or more in the future.

This information is questionable, but still worthy of a thread.
Your thoughts? Also, give up some rep+... Peace

[ZipIt]

Should it be like 10x?

36Mb/sec *10 = 360Mb/s?

It would be nice to have those speeds considering the fact that the capacity is high (20 gig ++). More news on the BD drives on the PS3 are welcomed.

P.S: Link doesn't work.

[Nameless]

Zip, try the link now, but you will need to translate unless you speak & read German...;-) Use this link my friend: http://www.google.com/language_tools?hl=en

[Garfunkel]

we need more people who can speak German on the forums...hopefully this great news is true so that we can lord it over 360 owners for having crap load times, hahahaha, i can see i now........

Edit
well the german numbers are the same as ours so it looks as though it may be accurate!

[ZipIt]

Thanks Nameless. And hell yeah, we need native speaking german in this forums and translate the website :P.

Anyway, did the Sony conference mentioned the blu-ray speeds? I might miss that one out. Maybe i'll just go and have a look on the video again.

[casualkiss]

Slow load times is my biggest pet peave. But i must say, the 360 is pretty damn good when it comes in that area! If PS3 is better, i will drool.

I think it should be mentioned for my fellow newbies that Mbps is NOT MBps. (8 bits = 1 byte). I can't tell you how many times that mistake kept me up at nights :)

[Garfunkel]

is "b" bits or bytes, i always get confused with that one.

[The_One]

b is bits, B is bytes.

As for the article, I smell major BS... 324Mbp/s would be 9x (324/36 = 9).
6x would only be 192Mbp/s (okay, scratch the "only", 'cause that's pretty damn fast already).

Is it just me, or does this seem like a German equivalent of IGN's "3 x 3.2Ghz cores equals 9Ghz" comment?

[Crossbar]

we need more people who can speak German on the forums...
Where is Heinrich when we need him?

[kaphwan]

hey... we should get an admin/mod to sticky a thread requesting anybody who fluently speaks a second language so that these articles can be read by all...

[Illmatic]

Considering the article is from the 17th of May, i doubt there's anything new here or even very relevant to what state BR speeds are now.

BR's big coming out party will be at CES, so not long to go now untill we find a whole lot of new info on PS3 and BR.

[warmachine]

I can speak German and it looks like this article is from the time right after the E3.

However, I do not know where they did get the speed of the BR-drive from. :(

Heinrich can speak German?

[Nasadus]

I am pretty fluent in the German language.
Since the article is from the day after the Sony press conference it would be logical to asume that they got their info from that very same event. Now, i have seen the entire Sony press conference and they didn't mention anything about the Blu-Ray drive speed. So where did they get those numbers from?

[NeoPlayStation]

As for the article, I smell major BS... 324Mbp/s would be 9x (324/36 = 9).
6x would only be 192Mbp/s (okay, scratch the "only", 'cause that's pretty damn fast already).

My Guess:

6x54Mbits/seg (1.5X - movie transfer rate) = 324Mbits/seg.

[xbdestroya]

Nasadus and Warmachine: thanks for the insights.

Well, heap it in the 'pure rumor' pile for now I guess!

[Domination]

b is bits, B is bytes.

As for the article, I smell major BS... 324Mbp/s would be 9x (324/36 = 9).
6x would only be 192Mbp/s (okay, scratch the "only", 'cause that's pretty damn fast already).

Is it just me, or does this seem like a German equivalent of IGN's "3 x 3.2Ghz cores equals 9Ghz" comment?


I'm thinking so.:laugh:

[rpgamer_2k5]

I 'heard' that the PS3 will have a 6x drive speed for the BDROM drive of the PS3. I remember myself or someone else bringing up this "rumour". I guess waiting til CES is the only solution. ;)

[Garfunkel]

But a 6x probbably wouldn't be possible by launch, maybe 3 - 4, but 6x?

[jaxmkii]

we need more people who can speak German on the forums...hopefully this great news is true so that we can lord it over 360 owners for having crap load times, hahahaha, i can see i now........

Edit
well the german numbers are the same as ours so it looks as though it may be accurate!
why are the gremans gettin so much tech info:wtf:

[F089/H]

Impossible...

[HereticPB]

Because Germans are smart technically. Politically that is another story.

Hold on it is not very clear.

Blu Ray:

Format developed by Apple, Dell, Disney, Sony, HP, Hitachi, LG Electronics, Matsushita, Mitsubishi, Pioneer, Philips, Samsung, Sharp, Sony, TDK, 20th Century Fox, and more

HD-DVD:

HD DVD has been standardized by the DVD Forum (international association of 200+ companies)

The following are single layer discs:

DVD -
Frequency: 650nm
Size: 4.7GB
Transfer Rate: 11.08 Mbps
Move Transfer Rate: 10.08 Mbps

HD-DVD -
Frequency: 405nm
Size: 15 - 20GB
Transfer Rate: 36.55 Mbps (1x speed)
Move Transfer rate: 36.55 Mbps

Blu-Ray -
Frequency: 405nm
Size: 25GB
Transfer Rate: 36Mbps (1x speed)
Movie Transfer rate: 54Mbps (1.5x speed)


Blu Ray: Expensive and no backwards compatiblity for disc but the players are backwards compatible. Movies have to run faster decreasing the life time of the Blu-Ray player. Blu Ray Movies will probably come out as 75Mbps rated (2x speed).

HD-DVD: Backwards compatibility for discs and players (read below) and cheaper. Movies run on 1x speed HD-DVD.

Compatiblity -
Alternative architectures include the ‘Combination’ disc, in which one side may be a conventional DVD-9 and the other a dual layer HD DVD. This offers a single inventory product for retailers and a future-proof acquisition for consumers.

There is also a technology proposal, approved by the DVD Forum as a format option in HD DVD-ROM version 1.2, for a ‘Twinformat’ disc, in which the layer closest to the pick-up head is reflective to red and transparent to blue-violet light. With this structure, a conventional DVD video player ‘sees’ the disc as a normal DVD-5, while the blue laser penetrates the first layer to read the HD DVD data behind.

3X DVD-ROM Brings the higher data rate of HD DVD to the conventional format, enabling
135 minutes of HD content to be placed on a DVD-ROM, using AVC or VC-1 codecs.

[xbdestroya]

On the DVD Forum thing, what does it matter how many companies are a part of it when half of the major names have abandoned it and gone to Blu-ray? Yet are still included in the HD-DVD company count through the DVD Forum...

As for 'compatability, Blu-ray's got the same thing going on as HD-DVD, and has for just as long:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/12/30/jvc_three-layer_dvd/

[masonite]

isn't there also proposals for a Blu-ray disc onto which both the DVD and blu-ray movie can be written, due to the superior capacity of the medium? which means the disc doesn't need both sides to have data on them, decreasing the risk of damage to the surface (try picking up a dual disc and you'll see what i mean...)

[xbdestroya]

Yeah the Blu-ray and DVD hybrid discs don't need to use both sides, they can have both layers on the same side. I think soem demo discs of exactly this were at CES in fact. But the disc would require a different layer to the regular blu-ray layer, as the layers would have to be read by a different frequency laser. I'm not sure that you're even under that assumption at all, but thought I'd clarify anyway. :)

[masonite]

Yeah the Blu-ray and DVD hybrid discs don't need to use both sides, they can have both layers on the same side. I think soem demo discs of exactly this were at CES in fact. But the disc would require a different layer to the regular blu-ray layer, as the layers would have to be read by a different frequency laser. I'm not sure that you're even under that assumption at all, but thought I'd clarify anyway. :)


yeh, i had a feeling it would have to be due to the different lasers required, but thanks for affirming that for me. :cheers:

it's still quite impressive - 25GB for the hybrid Blu-ray/DVD movie, compared to 30GB for the standard HD-DVD....and that's just for the dual layers... one quick question though, Blu ray is theoretically capable of up to 8 layers - what can HD-DVD achieve?

[HereticPB]

Well I can't find that on the Blu-Ray site about hybrid discs. I'll try looking again.

http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/

[masonite]

Well I can't find that on the Blu-Ray site about hybrid discs. I'll try looking again.

http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/


it was in a press release a few months ago:



Friday 30th September 2005

Blu-ray backers rebuff MS, Intel moves 3:55PM
Blu-ray backers Dell and HP have come to the defence of Sony's high-definition optical disc system following Microsoft's and Intel's decision to back the rival HD DVD format.
The world's two largest PC makers said that the decision - which Microsoft justified by identifying six shortcomings in Blu-ray - is based on inaccurate information.

'From a PC end-user perspective, Blu-ray is a superior format. It offers 67-150 per cent more storage capacity, higher transfer rates, slim-line notebook compatibility, broadband connectivity and a proven interactive layer with BD-Java,' said Maureen Weber, general manager of HP's Personal Storage Business.

In a joint statement the two companies claim that virtually every computer company that has expressed a preference for a high definition disc format has chosen Blu-ray.

They refute several of the points that Jordi Ribas, Microsoft's director of technology strategy for Windows Digital Media, used to explain the decision to back HD DVD. These include Microsoft's belief that Blu-ray will not be able produce the 50GB discs that it has promised, that consumers will not be able to backup discs, that Blu-ray will not be backward-compatible and does not support hybrid (dual format) discs that include both standard and high-definition content.

'Blu-ray Disc's capacity is 50GB,' they state. 'This will be available at launch for BD-ROM, BD-R, and BD-RE. This is 67 per cent more than HD-DVD's 30GB ROM capacity and 150 per cent more than its recordable storage capacity.'

They insist that Blu-ray and its AACS rights management system will permit managed copying and network streaming and that the Blu-ray players will play standard DVDs in the same way that HD DVD players will, by the addition of a red laser. Moreover they argue that Blu-ray hybrid discs will in fact be superior to its rival's.

'The Blu-ray Hybrid Disc is the more elegant solution as it holds both versions of the film on the same side of the disc, which provides for easy labeling and greater ease of use for consumers.'

They also point to the interactivity features of the format, with support for BD-Java, as 'a mature, robust platform for authoring and delivering unprecedented interactive capabilities to the user for movies, music, and games', which was chosen in preference to Microsoft's iHD technology deployed in HD DVD.

'The BDA [Blu-ray Disc Association] carefully compared both iHD and BD-J, and concluded that iHD didn't go far enough in providing a compelling feature set beyond DVD, while BD-J offered studios a much richer palette for providing a compelling interactive HD experience for consumers, particularly when a player is connected to a network.'

Kevin Kettler, Dell's chief technology officer, said the company's preference for Blu-ray is based on what its customers require.

'We are actively engaged with our customers who continue to tell us that features such as capacity, advanced interactivity, and industry wide support are of utmost importance when considering new optical solutions, he said. 'Based on this feedback and a comparison of the two formats, Dell has no doubt that Blu-ray Disc best meets the needs of computer users and provides the type of open industry standards needed to drive innovation and growth of the format across all platforms - consumer electronic, personal computers and gaming consoles.'

Simon Aughton



source (http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/78185/bluray-backers-rebuff-ms-intel-moves.html)

[HereticPB]

Okay thank you and I found it finally. Had to get the BD-Rom whitepaper.

Honestly, I do not know what disc will win. I prefer HD-DVD cause it will be cheaper but it would be nice to have up to a proposed 50GB of space of BD.

I give it about a year to 2 before we do know a winnner of this war!

Also many of the companies that are supporting Blu Ray support HD-DVD as well. All these companies have a back up plan. If blu ray goes down like betamax, mini-disc, Sony will once again have to swallow their egotistical pride.

[VG Aficionado]

Also many of the companies that are supporting Blu Ray support HD-DVD as well. All these companies have a back up plan. If blu ray goes down like betamax, mini-disc, Sony will once again have to swallow their egotistical pride.Blu-ray has more film studios supporting it exclusively. The only big one which is still exclusive to HDDVD is Universal Studios, and I've got the feeling they will end up supporting Blu-ray just like WB and Paramount did, since 5 of the 6 big studios are already supporting Blu-ray. PS3 will be decisive when it comes to support.

I still use minidiscs, I find them much more convenient than mp3 players in my case, audio quality is usually far superior and I've been using it before the boom of mp3. Minidisc lives on, while Betamax never had the support Blu-ray does, not to mention that it had a weak point in storage capacity while Blu-ray is the one with greatest storage capacity now.

[Chris Metal]

Well I can't find that on the Blu-Ray site about hybrid discs. I'll try looking again.

http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/

Thats not the official site though, this one is. http://www.blu-raydisc.com/