Jim Kahle(IBM) WCIT Video Interview-PS3 Cell is 9 cores!

[yoshaw]

:speechles :buldge: :shocked:

Video inteview done with Jim Kahle by some european dude at the World Congress of Information Technology 2006(May1-5). Did I miss this one on the board or am I the first one here to notice it?

Still, nine freaking cores. I don't know what to make of it other than for showing it to you guys. This is going to cause a fair bit of shuffle for guys on the opposite spectrum ;) We all know the usual suspects to appear sooner or later so lets make one thing clear, take it for what you will. Sony purposefully didn't disclose Cell/RSX specifications at E3. And now I found this so I'll make my own opinion just like everyone else is free to make their own. If PS3 cell is infact delivered at 9 cores at launch, that'd be freaking awesome for MILR. To me, it's more like wow, more worth for the 600 bucks.

Anyways, enough with the yapping. Checkout the video.

WCIT(World Congress on Information Technology) Jim Kahle (IBM Cell architect) Video Interview
http://www.savefile.com/files/9346498
http://rapidshare.de/files/22255120/JimKahle_Interview_PS3_Cell_is_9_cores_divx_.avi.h tml

http://xs301.xs.to/xs301/06231/Jimkahle_WCIT.jpg

[Kabbage]

9 Cores yes... 1 PPE 8 SPE's

He didnt say 9 active

One will still be deactivated and one will still be OS reserved

[yoshaw]

That so? ..... So by any stretch, he couldn't have meant that Cell in PS3 is 9 cores and a PPE?


bummer(sorry MILR). I tried man but seems like you're not getting your upgrades :laugh:

[jaxmkii]

hey they did say they where getting hight than expected yeilds for cell...

[pari]

Hmm... the background video demo (terrain mapping) looks interesting. And the die is still freaking big (relative speak)

[Sephiroth_VII]

Either he said somethinbg he shouldn't, or he was mistaken about the number of cores the PS3 would be using. If it's the first option, PS3 just got even better :hugegrin:

[Z]

PS3's Cell version is final: 7SPEs + 1 PPE.

what some get confused about is the average Cell and its other version yet to be announced.

[cliffbo]

only nine! i was expecting ten... :(

jesus he actually says that PS3 will have nine cores

[makeitlookreal]

Again, I am instantly rejoicing with glee just to be smashed to pieces once more. This is very, very frustrating.

I really, really wish Sony would come clean and tell us what they are up to with the PS3!

[cliffbo]

this is interesting because the whole point of my thread 'its a matter of timing' was to point out that to sustain a ten year life cycle in the face of a potential successor to 360, Sony must be sitting on undisclosed gems. this could be one of them!

by the way how long is the vid it cuts off just as he picks the chip up when i download it.

[RavenFox]

True ownage will be revelaed at TGS mark my words.

[venomv]

I think this very well could mean that the yeilds are good enough that they feel they no longer need to deactivate one of the SPE's. Or he could have misspoke.......

[cliffbo]

True ownage will be revelaed at TGS mark my words.

i'm 100% with you on this Raven... we have seen only what Sony consider safe to see...

[makeitlookreal]

If the yields are good enough having all eight SPE's active would be a very, very good thing. It would free up another SPE that developers could utilize instead of having wasted space on the chip. It seems like so much is being thrown on the Cell that it will need all the SPE's it can get.

[Red_Eyes]

It's not like Sony isn't telling anything. Everything Sony says something, Sony says it as clear as possible. But no matter how clear it is, people always turn it and twist it around and make it all confusing again.

[PhYmon]

Im with Kabbage cuz he said was that is 8 SPE and 1 PPE, but I woudnt bother if there where some sort of improve over the processor..

[makeitlookreal]

If Sony is so clear and honest about everything they say why did they remove the specifications for the RSX and CELL and replace them with absolutely nothing at all?

Sony is NOT being upfront and honest with us about the PS3. Of course they don't have to be, but I hope that their consumers will speak up with their dollars if they don't start being more open.

[Red_Eyes]

Well, they already gave us the specs at E3 2005. And until the specs changed or finalized, Sony doesn't need to show it again and again.

[cliffbo]

If Sony is so clear and honest about everything they say why did they remove the specifications for the RSX and CELL and replace them with absolutely nothing at all?

Sony is NOT being upfront and honest with us about the PS3. Of course they don't have to be, but I hope that their consumers will speak up with their dollars if they don't start being more open.

MILR... we are talking about the biggest industry in the world and the biggest project Sony have even undertaken in their long history. Cut Sony some slack they have to ballance what they can tell us with what they need to keep secret from their competitors...

[makeitlookreal]

Their competitors probably know almost everything they do and of course ten times more than we do!

Microsoft and Nintendo have billions of dollars, thousands of experts in the industry, and lots of connections. Do you really think Microsoft and Nintendo are in the dark about the PS3? They may not know everything, but I am certain they know much, much more than we do!

For goodness sakes, just think of all the people involved with the design and creation of the PS3. Then think of all the people with devkits. Imagine how easy it is for MS and Nintendo to get information! Seriously, they have lots of money to throw around at folks to get the info they need. It might not be nice, but you can be certain it is done.

Now, back to the point. We deserve to be told the full truth by Sony. They don't HAVE to tell us anything, but it sure would make me feel a lot more comfortable spending $599 for one of their products and over the next few years games, controllers, memory cards, etc.

They need to tell us what is going on!

[overclocked]

What truth, it isnt a Alien conspiracy.

[ded5850]

...or is it...

[LaLiLuLeLo]

MILR, what's your deal? You go on and on about this, as if PS3 is underpowered or something. It's clearly a very powerful machine, potentially the strongest even (as in, we're pretty sure), and you're still demanding more and more tech? Why? You get the console for the games you play on it, not the microchips under the hood. I didn't buy a PS2 because 'omg teh emotion engine and graphics synthesizer are teh nutz!!!' I got it cuz I like the ps family of games.

[Infernal]

Now, back to the point. We deserve to be told the full truth by Sony. They don't HAVE to tell us anything, but it sure would make me feel a lot more comfortable spending $599 for one of their products and over the next few years games, controllers, memory cards, etc.
Cant see why. MILR you cant even buy the PS3 for another 5 months, so Sony doesnt need you to feel comfortable spending 599$ on one of their products just yet. I guarantee you they will release everything your asking for before the PS3 launches, but that is still 5 months away. Telling you that the cell is suddenly 5.6ghz or something isnt going to make you purchase a PS3, because you CANT purchase one right now. They still have time, in the meantime I suggest you take a break from looking for PS3 information if it aggrivates you that much.

[section]

In a more perfect world people who for months and months just moan and iterate their impatience (with PS3 or anything next gen in particular) would now go and buy themselves nice, brand new, shining Microsoft next gen consoles and start playing the games and stop moaning on forums.

I think we all agree it would make everybody happy, neh? :)

About the Kahle "interview", I think he just restated what has been originally told, 1PPE 8SPEs, -1SPE for redundancy. Nothing mindblowing there and I'm nevertheless happy if they are able to keep the 8th SPE.

[venomv]

About the Kahle "interview", I think he just restated what has been originally told, 1PPE 8SPEs, -1SPE for redundancy. Nothing mindblowing there and I'm nevertheless happy if they are able to keep the 8th SPE.

That could be, but I think it is a strange way to say that, unles he is just trying to make it sound better then it is.

[LaLiLuLeLo]

that's possible, why not? But eventually what's gonna happen is cell will start hitting a wall with the RSX, so even if there were all 7, or even 8 or 9 spe's active the cell in ps3 can only be pushed so far because the RSX, while powerful is still limited. It's not a bottemless pit of processing power. It's vast, but finite nonetheless.
Maybe PS4 will discard numbers that we can even comprehend, its CPU and GPU being partially infused with infinity.

[section]

^^Well processing power doesn't have to go hand in hand with graphics power, there's nothing stopping the developers using Cell for any additional types of calculations for the gaming needs if the RSX is already saturated.

At the moment the biggest problem with the one PPE-multiple SPEs conductor-orchestra model so widely used in this initial stage of Cell programming seems to be that the PPE to my knowledge is widely used as a partitioner and packer for data sent to SPE crunching and because there are so many SPEs and only one relatively slow PPE it usually starts bottlenecking the overall performance.

As the programmers say Cell will only start to show it's best weapons when the more sophisticated, Cell oriented programming models are starting to get used.

[Z]

Maybe PS4 will discard numbers that we can even comprehend, its CPU and GPU being partially infused with infinity.
Edit/Delete Message
and its slogan will be; "to infinity, and beyond!"

[Kabbage]

It seems like so much is being thrown on the Cell that it will need all the SPE's it can get.

Where the hell do you get all this

hahaha

[Kabbage]

Again, I am instantly rejoicing with glee just to be smashed to pieces once more. This is very, very frustrating.

I really, really wish Sony would come clean and tell us what they are up to with the PS3!

Good Lord... you need to quit the internet.

Yeah tell Sony to come clean when it is Jim Kahle from IBM.

[makeitlookreal]

Kabbage,

I have read several articles where developers are using at least a couple of SPE's for a certain feature of the game. In many of the articles different features such as AI, physics, raytracing, vertex work for the RSX, decoding data from the disk, sound, and others were been performed by SPE's.

Basically, trying to add up all these different features and the SPE's that have been used for them quickly causes the Cell to run out of SPE's. Yes, I know it is not as simple as one SPE being forever reserved for one specific task. There is load balancing, but at the same time I am just concerned that the Cell has been given too many tasks to perform. Yes, I believe it can do all of them, but no processor chip on the entire planet can do a whole slew of tasks and do each one to it's very best.

Now, if I hear a developer say the following,

"Yeah, the Cell is great. Those SPE's are amazing little buggers. We are doing top notch physics, feeding the RSX with all the data it can handle, performing raytracing, generating fantatic sound, have basically an artificially intelligent Terminator T-1000 inside our game, and the best particle effects you have ever seen in a game. The sad thing is, we are still trying to figure out more we can do with all the left over power since we still have the equivalent of an SPE to spare."

THEN and only then will I say the Cell needs no help whatsoever and is not being over burdoned.

[tien69]

Darn, i kinda forgot what the initial converstaion was, lol. Well about that SPE being on reserve. And they are using a built-in flash memory for the OS, and leaving teh HDD, completely fred up. Would that not take care of that, for those who cringe that the SPE's are being chopped down, lol. From 8 to 7 to 6 and then 5. Me myself, was wondering what the next one would be reserved for.

I believe Sony themselves spread bad information here and there, better to have people a little underexpecting, and then slapping them dead in the face with the goodness. Yeah, I think TGS, will have the forums more abuzzed than E3 ever did.

And I remember tha PS1 chipset being tucked away in the corner of the PS2's motherboard. It was said Devs coudl use the 2MB of ram on the PS1'a chipset to use on the PS2's function if they wanted to. So that means the if all this is true, that x360's holy grail , the eDRAM, would be on that PS2 chipset. Hmmmmmmm, 32MB, whick 'may'be able to play nice with it;s badder big brother. Just thinking folks.

[cliffbo]

Darn, i kinda forgot what the initial converstaion was, lol. Well about that SPE being on reserve. And they are using a built-in flash memory for the OS, and leaving teh HDD, completely fred up. Would that not take care of that, for those who cringe that the SPE's are being chopped down, lol. From 8 to 7 to 6 and then 5. Me myself, was wondering what the next one would be reserved for.

I believe Sony themselves spread bad information here and there, better to have people a little underexpecting, and then slapping them dead in the face with the goodness. Yeah, I think TGS, will have the forums more abuzzed than E3 ever did.

And I remember tha PS1 chipset being tucked away in the corner of the PS2's motherboard. It was said Devs coudl use the 2MB of ram on the PS1'a chipset to use on the PS2's function if they wanted to. So that means the if all this is true, that x360's holy grail , the eDRAM, would be on that PS2 chipset. Hmmmmmmm, 32MB, whick 'may'be able to play nice with it;s badder big brother. Just thinking folks.

i was thinking in a similar way but daren't post because i know very little about the internal gubbins of computers and consoles. i don't think Sony have mislead us with bad information its just that we've filled in the spaces ourelves withour really knowing what Cell or Rsx can do. they are waiting for TGS....