Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots

[frosty]

I'll play this game when i'm not so broke... i've been envious of all of you for some time now.

[Passive]

Aww poor frosty =[ well if it means anything, ive played it through enough times for the both of us? :P

[Jay Gee]

Finally started story mode today...yes i know....and i love it!

Online can kiss my ass though >_>
Online's great too. It's a complete package. Somebody just suuuuuuuuuuuucks.:spit:

[jaxmkii]

Viper doesn't have a PS3?

to the best of my knowlege no...

[rockleex]

Anyone figure out how to fight the secret boss yet? O_o

[curryking1]

Secret boss what now?

[masteratt]

I think he is just drunk :drunk:

[Sephiroth_VII]

Lol wut.

[Hisham]

MGS4 is the only thing in any medium of storytelling that has made me TOTALLY lose faith. Kojima is God for coming up with the microwave scene. The amounts of emotions I felt from that moment alone makes up for more than all I've ever felt in my whole experience of video games.

I seriously thought it was game over and everybody was going to die. I seriously thought Kojima was going to stomp Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet and pull off the biggest tragedy in the history of fiction.

By the way, I think I have an idea why Kojima is the voice of God. He might be the secret boss that no one ever found in MGS4. Or am I wrong and someone already found the secret boss?

Read this post and you'll get what he means.

And no, I really just think it was a joke credit.

[Sephiroth_VII]

Maybe it's a very well hidden easter egg...

It could be part of the reward for earning the Big Boss badge as well, since I don't think anyone has done it yet.

[GTAce]

I justve seen the German TV ad and it had a good voice actor but also some little spoilers. lol

[OG_Monkey]

Online's great too. It's a complete package. Somebody just suuuuuuuuuuuucks.:spit:

lol, its funny cuz your right. I played like 10 games, god i just keep getting my ass handed to me. And i played the day it came out and got beat badly so i guess they were beta players who got a head start.

I mean, its OK but i wasnt expecting much from the online mode, pretty much the same as when i used to play MGS Portable Ops online.

But does ANYONE talk online in ANY PS3 games? I plugged in a bluetooth headset...heard tumbleweeds go by.

[masteratt]

hahahaha

Nah man you are right, not many people chat lol (it annoys me when no-one chat son GTA4 online!)

Which I THINK is a bad thing but then I go on Xbox Live and hear annoying douchebags in almost every game and it pisses me off lol and then I'm glad not many people talk on PSN.

Best way to online game is to get together with friends and mic up.

I only played a few MGO matches but does it let cross-region play? And friend matching?

If so, i have mic OG, we'll play.

[OG_Monkey]

Dunno. And just like the PSP MGS, i cant host games due to some "condition that blah blah is in". I guess i gotta open some ports but fuck it.

How does PSN work, are they friend invites? Private matches?

[Passive]

I know, i know. It's late. so shoot me :P


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When Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty came out in 2001, a great deal of the fanbase reacted in outrage and confusion. Since then, we have eagerly, awaited an explanation for the convoluted ending of Sons of Liberty, and the opportunity to take control of Solid Snake once again. In 2004, Hideo Kojima returned us to the world of Metal Gear, only for us to discover that it was a prequel focusing instead on the notorious Big Boss, Snake’s ‘father’. It was unexpected, but greeted favourably. However, fans still wanted Kojima to continue with Solid Snake’s story. Finally, in 2008, what has been described as the most anticipated video game in history has arrived at last, and it was worth the seven year wait. Hideo Kojima’s latest effort is, quite simply, a masterpiece.

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Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots reintroduces gamers to Solid Snake. Only Snake’s not exactly as we remember him. Due to some unknown cause, Snake has entered into a state of accelerated aging and by his own calculation, has one year left before he dies. Meanwhile, in the wake of the events depicted at the end of Sons of Liberty, the world has become a place where Private Military Corporations (PMCs) dominate the battlefield, and the world’s best source of economy is war. War has become a business. One man has gathered five of the world’s largest PMCs to his flock, Snake’s seemingly immortal nemesis Liquid Snake, in the body of Revolver Ocelot. Contacted by his old commander and friend, Roy Campbell, Old Snake is hired to track down and kill Liquid once and for all. This is the premise of the story, and to reveal anything more would be to spoil the climax to one of the greatest sagas ever told.

It needs to be said that every promise made by Hideo Kojima before the game’s release has been kept. Every single question that might have arisen during playthroughs of previous titles has an answer in MGS4. Whether it be an important plot device (just how in the hell did Liquid manage to come back to life in Ocelot’s body) or a minor, offhand piece of dialogue (what exactly was Vulcan Raven talking about when he told Solid Snake “Blood from the east flows in your veins”?), it is all given closure. The game even addresses the fates of characters from the prequel titles, Meta Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater and Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops, surprisingly relying on these titles as the foundations of Metal Gear’s established history.

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In fact, the story is nearly so overwhelming that a lot of casual Metal Gear fans will have a hard time following. It’s highly suggested that the player brushes up on their history before playing. It’s not just the plot itself which can be overwhelming, but the way in which is is presented to the player. Ever since the conception of Metal Gear Solid on the PlayStation, it’s been Hideo Kojima’s goal to create a game which pays homage to Hollywood blockbusters. Guns of the Patriots, without any doubt, is the most cinematic video game ever created. The cutscenes are amazing in every way, shape and form. Voice acting is phenominal, the cinematography is superb and the script if flawless. Many times i found myself drawn in and forgetting i was even playing a game. There were scenes that envoked pure emotions like happiness, anger, nostalgia, excitment, anxiety and a deep sadness. This game seems to have more cutscenes than any of the previous games however, and they run extremely long. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, but the inclusion of a pause feature during cutscenes is quite welcome.

As previously stated the voice acting in the game is nothing short of perfect. David Hayter returns to the role, adding a degree of realistic illness to Snake’s voice. Almost every line Hayter delivers is rife with sickness, an indication of his unnatural aging and failing body. It’s great to hear old favourites returning to their respective roles. Christopher Randolph as Otacon, Paul Eiding as Campbell, Debi Mae West as Meryl, Jennifer Hale as Naomi, Kim Mai Guest as Mei Ling and Phil LaMarr as Vamp all bring the same level of quality they have previously. Special mentions need to go Patric Zimmerman as Liquid Ocelot and Quinton Flynn as Raiden whose voices are so unique and captivating, and perhaps some of the best vocal performances in games to date. Newcomers are welcome enough as well, such as Lee Merriweather as Big Mama and well known voice actor Richard Doyle in a surprise role which is sure to delight most fans.

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The gameplay in Metal Gear Solid 4 is perhaps the greatest improvement the series has made. Taking the new control scheme from Sons of Liberty and combing it with new gameplay elements introduced in Snake Eater, we have a style which has been refined to point of perfection. Snake has plenty of new techniques and abilities at his disposal, as well as some handy tools to employ on the battlefield. First and foremost is the OctoCamo suit. It takes the successful camouflage system from Snake Eater and streamlines it: simply press up against any flat surface, and the suit adopts its colour and texture pattern. It doesn’t come off as gimmicky, in fact it’s integral to mission completion. The best part is that you can’t rely on it to make you invisible. If you activate OctoCamo in alert mode, soldiers will be more inquisitive, and if you’re bumped into while disguised as a pile of rocks, well, the jig is up.

Another useful tool is the Metal Gear Mk. II, a small robot built by Otacon which can go on reconnaissance for Snake, and collect items and ammunition as well as knock out soldiers with an electric shock. The use of this item is completely up to the player’s choice. You can complete the whole game without using it if you’re so inclined, but it does come in handy, especially for deactivating traps. It’s also essential for unlocking bonuses during mission briefings, including extra items and camouflage options for Snake to use.

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Initially, some gamers were worried that Guns of the Patriots might focus too much on action and less on stealth. This couldn’t be farther from the truth. On easy mode, it’s all well and good to run and gun your way through nearly every situation, but try that on any other mode and you’ll find yourself and the Game Over screen becoming quite acquainted. Even in the middle of a live battle situation, stealth is the key to survival. It’s just a whole new kind of stealth. Snake can now sneak up behind an enemy, hold them up and search them for items and ammunition at gunpoint, before knocking them out (or killing them.) Snake can lay on his back and edge his way along the ground with a grenade, and hurl it overhead into a skirmish going on behind him. And the forementioned Octocamo suit will become your best friend if used correctly

Snake also now has two new meters to keep check on aside from the health meter. There’s the psyche meter, and the stress meter. The battle environment can be a tough place and certain actions will impact Snake’s stress and psyche. Thankfully there are useful, and often humourous ways to restore these meters, including reading Playboy magazine or lighting up a cigarette. Some would say it's not as important as MGS3s stamina bar but i beg to differ, keep a close eye on both new meters as it will effect your aiming, ability to heal and snake will perform badly such as ache in pain or fall down stairs (lets face it he's not the man he once was).

The controls are as intuitive and responsive as ever. It’s the typical Metal Gear control scheme with a few new implementations. These include over the shoulder aiming like Gears of war or GRAW Making shooting a breeze this time around and also a much better first person view that can be kept on if the player wishes. Another nice new function is complete camera control with the right analog stick, and the ability to switch which shoulder the camera looks over when aiming in third person mode by clicking the left analog stick. It gives a new tactical edge in battle and players will find themselves relying on it a lot.

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Graphically, the game is beautiful. It is one of, it not the best looking game currently available on home consoles. The character models are so detailed that the skin on Snake’s face stretches and folds realistically depending on his movements. Textures are fantastic, especially on character models, and nearly never flat. The locations are gorgeous and feel alive, with the exception of one area of the game which unfortunately comes off as generic and barren. The framerate never drops and the game runs smoothly, even with explosions and gunfire going off in all directions. There are very few instances where animation comes off a bit too exaggerated, but that’s made up for by the incredible facial detail on the characters.

As always, Yoji Shinkawa’s character designs and art direction is at once eye-catching and unique, especially the new GEKKO which both conforms to the generic Japanese mecha cliche, and also rejects it at the same time. The designs for the new characters aren’t as outrageous as previous games, which is a bit of a shame, but they’re still very unique in their own way and serve purpose with their own story arc for example The bosses in MGS4 each have little details to them that compliment the character as a whole.

Harry Gregson-Williams stepped on board once more to compose the music for MGS4, and as always it rivals most Hollywood scores. Unfortunately, the game doesn’t feature the famous theme song the previous games are known for (it was pointed out that the theme song was coincidentally similar to another, older song) and, petty as it seems, the score suffers for it. Don’t misunderstand, the new music composed for Guns of the Patriots is brilliant. There are several main theme songs which all evoke a lot of images and emmotions, especially the themes Old Snake, Love Theme and Sorrow which are at first full of sadness, loneliness and escalates into a feeling of trying to overcome the sadness. The song Father and Son is also a standout piece of music, which will put a sad smile on anyone’s face when they hear it.

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Make no mistake at all, Guns of the Patriots is one of the most involved and exciting games currently available. It takes roughly 15 to 20 hours to complete it, but gamers can get a lot more time clocked in if they choose to go after all the extra items, guns and rankings, giving it great replay value. The gameplay is perfect and fun, the visuals are almost CGI quality, and perhaps most importantly, it is a brilliant climax to what has been one of the industry’s most successful series. Hideo Kojima’s finally given the series, and Solid Snake, the farewell he’s been planning for years, and it’s executed in such a way as to be powerful, moving and inspiring. I can think of no other way this story would have or should have gone, its the perfect ending for such a legendary hero. And just how does it all end? you'll have to experience that for yourself, because take my word for it.

Theres nothing else like it.

[Smokey]

Best way to online game is to get together with friends and mic up.



always the best way to play... have atleast 1-2 mates on your side

[Passive]

Pitty MGO is region locked =[

[OG_Monkey]

WHAT!? No way!

[Passive]

Yeah, smokey and i can't play with you US guys =[ i think there are 3 regions. Euro, Japan and US.

[Hisham]

Konami slipped with that...

DAMNIT!

This means no e-mpire clan then?

[solidsnakejej]

Yea I think they really need to do a total revision of MGO because it's probably the hardest game to play with friends. And has several other problems that need to be address especially the multiple IDs you need.

[Hisham]

Good review, I agree with a lot of stuff.

I want Yatzee to do a review on MGS4 next week. Hopefully he does one lol.

[Passive]

I think he will, should be pretty win too.

[solidsnakejej]

Good review but I think Khary Payton should be mentioned for his job voicing Drebin. Also the sound design is the best in any game to date and sets the bar to another level for all games. Also about the Main theme I believe Metal Gear Saga is it. When ever I hear the theme it always gives me chills.

[Sephiroth_VII]

I doubt Yahtzee will like MGS4. Way too many cutscenes for his taste.

[Sephiroth_VII]

Yeah, the gameplay itself is fine, but unified servers really are a must in this internet age.

[Segitz]

Want to become Drebin...

here's your chance^^

http://www.tanksforsale.co.uk/OT64_SKOT_APC_for_sale_page.htm

[Segitz]

I doubt Yahtzee will like MGS4. Way too many cutscenes for his taste.

Yeah... and him pissing all over jrpgs is even worse in my opinion... Not that I don't entitle him to express his opinion, but since he doesn't like them at all, he should just shut the f*ck up about them... I don't see me complaining about every shooter there is, because they are always AND always the same...

[Sephiroth_VII]

Well, he doesn't usually play them, only when the site he works for asks him to review one.

[Sephiroth_VII]

Let's buy one for Lali! :hugegrin:

[Jay Gee]

lol, its funny cuz your right. I played like 10 games, god i just keep getting my ass handed to me. And i played the day it came out and got beat badly so i guess they were beta players who got a head start.
I'm guessing you went straight into the regular rooms? Next time try automatching. It actually matches you with other folks of your skill level. It's there, so use it, dude.

[Hisham]

Yeah... and him pissing all over jrpgs is even worse in my opinion... Not that I don't entitle him to express his opinion, but since he doesn't like them at all, he should just shut the f*ck up about them... I don't see me complaining about every shooter there is, because they are always AND always the same...

It is all in fun. It is his job to rile people up. He is a critic, so he'll basically point out everything bad and run with it.

I still love his reviews though, even though I do tend to disagree with them now and again.

[Segitz]

It is all in fun. It is his job to rile people up. He is a critic, so he'll basically point out everything bad and run with it.

I still love his reviews though, even though I do tend to disagree with them now and again.

Well yes, I know... but too many other people don't get that... which is the problem I am having^^

[Diresu]

Just beat the game...There really is no way to describe the experience. Its generations ahead of anything before it in every way. This is now officially, my favorite game, ever.

[LiquidEagle]

Just beat the game...There really is no way to describe the experience. Its generations ahead of anything before it in every way. This is now officially, my favorite game, ever.

BOO YAH! Congratulations :)

[JasonXe]

lol i'm watching the 1up show and there is way to make the girl boobs shake by shaking the controller. Thats worth a purchase for me but need a ps3. Someone buy me a ps3 or lend it to me one for a weekend. Actually, OG, i think you live near me so come down and let me play some mgs.

[err_ok]

Why oh why is there no load menu or last checkpoint thing ingame... so irritating when trying to get no alerts etc... :(

[xenon626]

have you gotten everything from the game?

[Sephiroth_VII]

I think they did that on purpose to make it feel like there was more at stake while sneaking. It sure works :rant:

[curryking1]

^I think I must've restarted/exited from the SP in the game, on my first playthru alone, two hundred times.

At least.

It was the only way I was going to get the Octopus award... and the Stealth Camo item :D

On my second, Extreme, playthru I've probably clocked at least twenty, thirty or so exits by the time I've beaten Laughing Octopus. :D

[Hisham]

I beat Octopus yesterday with just my knife stunning her. It took me like 3 hours haha.

[err_ok]

Sons of the Bitch's

[Passive]

^ wut?

Well i've now finished the game on every setting :P Easy was just stupidly easy lol.

[rockleex]

Anyways, I noticed there's a respawn glitch in MGO. Sometimes when you die, right after you respawn, you'll die again by the same person who killed you.

Sometimes I'll kill somebody and get killed by them at the same time, and right when you both respawn, you'll both "get killed by each other" again... or at least that's what the game thinks.

Konami needs to fix this. >_<

Want to become Drebin...

here's your chance^^

http://www.tanksforsale.co.uk/OT64_SKOT_APC_for_sale_page.htm

Holy... I wonder if they let you ride around town with that.

[rockleex]

Secret boss what now?

I remember reading about the secret boss back when some people got to go on an MGS4 camp a few months before the game was out.

All they said was that during the camp, although everybody beat the game, no one ever found the secret boss. Or something...

Hopefully its not just the white screen with the Beauties... >_<

[venomv]

Hmm, I've never ran into that bug, at least, not that I've noticed.

[curryking1]

I've ran into it once or twice. It's not very often it happens, but it's there.

[AC!D]

I remember reading about the secret boss back when some people got to go on an MGS4 camp a few months before the game was out.

All they said was that during the camp, although everybody beat the game, no one ever found the secret boss. Or something...

Hopefully its not just the white screen with the Beauties... >_<

I also remember reading that somewhere. Did anybody actually find that boss?

[Sephiroth_VII]

Not yet it seems... Could be fun if someone found it in a few years.

[HPK]

I also remember reading that somewhere. Did anybody actually find that boss?

I think that "boss" came in another form. Like, you didn't really fight him but you did kill him.

*hint hint*

[masteratt]

^ wut?

Well i've now finished the game on every setting :P Easy was just stupidly easy lol.

Okay you are THE biggest MGS fan I know, congrats.

I LOVE the games I really do but I love experiencing them once or twice and maybe re-play them if any cool extras come up that I want to discover but playing it on every difficulty?
Man that's just nutjob style. :worthy:

Once again, congrats. :clap:

[AC!D]

I think that "boss" came in another form. Like, you didn't really fight him but you did kill him.

*hint hint*

Maybe but surely not all the media would have run out right after the first credit rolled?

[curryking1]

I was thinking maybe the secret boss encounter may be triggered in a similar way to MGS3.

The one which you load a file saved after Snake is captured and is thrown into a jail cell... maybe the MGS4 one is like that? That you have to save, exit, and load at a particular point in the game?

But if it were that it seems like someone would have reached it already...

Another idea I had was maybe it is with one of the beauties... maybe with one of the beauties you can trigger a special battle instead of the 'white room' event?

Otherwise it seems like maybe you need to have done particular things in the game in addition to a special loading event at a particular time... I dunno.

That's all the ideas I got.

Edit -

Actually my final idea is maybe the event you must trigger is finding all of the 'audio flashbacks' in Shadow Moses combined with something else... like a loading thing or something again.

[Passive]

Okay you are THE biggest MGS fan I know, congrats.

I LOVE the games I really do but I love experiencing them once or twice and maybe re-play them if any cool extras come up that I want to discover but playing it on every difficulty?
Man that's just nutjob style. :worthy:

Once again, congrats. :clap:


Haha i dunno i just can;t seem to stop playing this one for some reason, i played through all the previous games on every difficulty but over time :P never this fast. and ive changed my txt aleryt tone on my cell phone to the ! sound and the codec sound when im getting a call. i've gone into massive MGS fever this month :P I've found that playing thorugh it on each difficulty has helped my Big Boss award run alot. ive been getting through each area really fast but as soon as i hit the beauties i slow down alot, having to restart at my saves and wantnot and trying not to be hit and such, or use rations. but going back and doing them all on very easy ive been able to fun around without having to worry about my health, so i can stand there and take a ass kicking and figure out which guns hurt the most, what ways work the best, where to be on the maps those kinda things. so very easy is good in that way. for those who want to know I'm in the process of fighting wolf right now on my BB run. she's proving time consuming so im trying to figure out fasterr ways.

[Bsack]

I feel ashamed. I'm barely starting Act 3.

[Passive]

You should feel ashamed. very ashamed.

[Segitz]

You should feel ashamed. very ashamed.

QFT

[Hisham]

I'm almost done my second runthrough on Extreme.

How many times do you have to kill Vamp before you can grab him? Seriously. I've killed him twice and I still couldn't grab him and I ended up getting pwnt.

[curryking1]

You have to get him three or four times.

Didn't you already beat him on the first runthrough? Noob! Lol j/k.

[Hisham]

Yes I beat him on my first run through, I just killed him like 4 times without realizing it then grabbing him.

I tried doing it the first 2 times, and got my ass knocked down lol.

[venomv]

On the harder normal difficulty, I think it's solid normal, you don't have to take him out that many times, I think I got him on the second time.

[Passive]

first time, everytime for me. once you know the trick its easy as pie :)

[TEEDA]

Just came back from my local store.
they had tones of posters to steal.
got those two.
http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/7043/12we3.th.jpg (http://img47.imageshack.us/my.php?image=12we3.jpg)

[LiquidEagle]

Very nice! I would use one poster to cover up they other's logo in that bottom right corner

[err_ok]

I'm almost done my second runthrough on Extreme.

How many times do you have to kill Vamp before you can grab him? Seriously. I've killed him twice and I still couldn't grab him and I ended up getting pwnt.

Yes I beat him on my first run through, I just killed him like 4 times without realizing it then grabbing him.

I tried doing it the first 2 times, and got my ass knocked down lol.

You need to have a pistol or knife equipped.. The rifle cqc is odd...

[Sephiroth_VII]

You can do it the first time, it's all about the timing.

[curryking1]

Oh really? Nice, that's good to know... maybe it can be quicker to get through that battle then...

[Hisham]

You need to have a pistol or knife equipped.. The rifle cqc is odd...

Yes I know. You can't grab people with the rifle CQC. That CQC is just for takedowns.

And hmm, I tried grabbing him various times on his first bar and couldn't. Everytime he knocked me off of him. And the same thing happened after I killed him once too. I guess I will just have to do some trial and error.

[masteratt]

I'm pretty sure you have to down him a few times then Otacon screams NOW SNAKE! and then you get him.

err_ok must have been playing at an easier difficulty.

[curryking1]

Are you sure man?

He never called 'Now Snake' for me. Or I wasn't paying attention. I just went on to grab him when he was getting up especially slowly lol.

Btw I'll play some online GTA-age if you're still gonna be awake for it lol.

[masteratt]

Yeah man Otacon was talking at me through the whole fight, kinda got annoying since I didn't even call him for tips.

"it's nearly fixed Snake."
"look in your inventory Snake!"
"Grab him Snake!"
"NOW SNAKE!"
etc

[curryking1]

***t I never got to the 'nearly fixed' part at all...

I guess I was just too 1337 and fast and pwnzorz etc etc etc ;)

And of course the times I died... he was too fast pwnzorz-ing me... :(

[err_ok]

Yeah man Otacon was talking at me through the whole fight, kinda got annoying since I didn't even call him for tips.

"it's nearly fixed Snake."
"look in your inventory Snake!"
"Grab him Snake!"
"NOW SNAKE!"
etc

When did that happen ? Are you sure you didn't just take freeking years to figure out what to do ?

[HPK]

I don't recall having Otacon giving me verbal support in the Vamp battle at all. I remember him saying stuff in my first confrontation but after he died, Otacon was quietly waiting for me to kill Vamp.

Question: If I were able to slice Vamp into small pieces, or even into just 2 pieces, would he still live? Like, would he regenerate body parts?

[curryking1]

When did that happen ? Are you sure you didn't just take freeking years to figure out what to do ?

LOL! That's the response I'm supposed to make. :(

Maybe it's the difficulty too? He gives advice faster maybe? Were you playing Normal masteratt?

The only thing I heard him say was something like 'Hold Vamp off!' or 'Kill that bastard!'

Oh wait actually it was like... 'I'll take care of this and you take care of Vamp!' at the very beginning I think.

[err_ok]

Question: If I were able to slice Vamp into small pieces, or even into just 2 pieces, would he still live? Like, would he regenerate body parts?

I think having to drop debris on him and split him in two would have been a more interesting fight ;)

[Sephiroth_VII]

I don't recall having Otacon giving me verbal support in the Vamp battle at all. I remember him saying stuff in my first confrontation but after he died, Otacon was quietly waiting for me to kill Vamp.

Question: If I were able to slice Vamp into small pieces, or even into just 2 pieces, would he still live? Like, would he regenerate body parts?

He can regenerate brain tissue, so limbs should be a walk in the park for him.

[Hisham]

Shouldn't he be able to die by being beheaded? Really, the nanomachines can only do so much lol. I really doubt they could regenerate a head. They could probably keep the body and head living seperately, but with no electrical inputs from his brain, his body would just be a shell. And you can't really do anything, just being a head.

[Passive]

Yeah i think he sort of follows the basic traits of the mythological vampire lore. except of course death by garlic, sunlight, silver, stakes. that sort of thing BUT i think cutting off his arm would seriously slow him down, a bullet through the head is one thing but losing a limb entirely? i'm not sure the nanos would be able to do that efficiantly, he would probably pic his arm up and hold the stump back to his body and it would probably graft back on given enough power. But severing his head would kill him i think. it would sever his central nervous system and also any connection he has to his body, maybe he would be able to survive for a while but the ammount of blood loss would be too much for his nanos to maintain the healing after all they are in his blood. Just like if you shot him with a well placed RPG to the chest, it'd blow him to pieces and there would be now way he'd get back up.

Vamp is immortal to wounds and smaller mortal wounds like bullet holes, losing of limbs but complete dismemberment? i think not.

[err_ok]

a bullet through the head is one thing but losing a limp entirely?

The nano machines would be able to regenerate the brain tissue... but it wouldn't hold all his memories and stuff still...

[Passive]

Yeah that's true, but his memories aren't the issue here. The ways to kill him are. unless you knew exactly where to shoot him in the brain so it would remove his memories of why he's fighting you :P haha

[err_ok]

^ i think a bullet through the head although healed would probably leave you pretty much vegetablised...

[Passive]

Exepct Vamp has been shot in the head 3 times now :P so clearly this shows the nanos are able to regenerate brain tissue and the information stored in it. Maybe the nanos store his brain function information as sort of a buffer or a back up incase of such an event? who knows. but as its shows the nanos can heal brain tissue without causing damage to the brains functions.

[venomv]

Maybe the nanos store his brain function information as sort of a buffer or a back up incase of such an event?

I was going to suggest just that.

[curryking1]

I doubt it's that.

It's suggested over and over again the nanomachines don't have the capacity to change a person into someone else.

I'd assume they don't approach the level of storing memories either.

I'd just call it one of those common inconsistencies that's in any wild fictional story.

Kind of like... Vamp doesn't always need to be defeated by being shot in the head, but it adds to the flavour of his style and crazy nano-immortality so that's the route that is taken. And to the style they want the cutscenes too.

[Sephiroth_VII]

There's a huge difference between storing data to recreate destroyed brain tissue and rewriting the entire brain. They would need to remove the brain via surgery, then have nanomachines moved from on body into the other, and then have them recreate the brain from the body they just left.

I thinjk it'd almost be easier to just to a brain transfer -.-

[curryking1]

My brother's response to what you just wrote:

"Is everyone on this site on crack or something?"

Brain transfer works in hypothetical situations for the purposes of philosophical discussions, but...

HAHAHAHAHAHA! That was the most cracked out post ever hahahaha.

[curryking1]

By the way, in the Japanese version of MGS4 is it easier to lose psyche/stamina?

I feel when I'm playing MGS4 I don't run the risk of losing the psyche bar.

Does it only get strongly affected during heated exchanges during alerts?

[err_ok]

Exepct Vamp has been shot in the head 3 times now :P so clearly this shows the nanos are able to regenerate brain tissue and the information stored in it. Maybe the nanos store his brain function information as sort of a buffer or a back up incase of such an event? who knows. but as its shows the nanos can heal brain tissue without causing damage to the brains functions.

It's a game... so it doesn't clearly show anything ;)

[Sephiroth_VII]

My brother's response to what you just wrote:

"Is everyone on this site on crack or something?"

Brain transfer works in hypothetical situations for the purposes of philosophical discussions, but...

HAHAHAHAHAHA! That was the most cracked out post ever hahahaha.

I know brain transfers aren't possible today, but this is fucking MGS, where people can survive crashing in a helicopter armed with explosives, and cyborg ninjas are commonplace.

[VG Aficionado]

"Snake, insert Disc 2!
...
Oh, wait a minute..."

:lol:

Wow, it's been long since I last posted in this thread =-o

[masteratt]

Can I bring up a point here guys?.......

Wouldn't it have been easier to just swap discs instead of waiting for a 4minute install to be done before each act?.....¬_¬

Though I think on second play through it doesn't install (at least the first Act didn't) which is nice.

[VG Aficionado]

An install doesn't require you to get up, so no :norris: And swapping discs doesn't give you any benefits in terms of loading speed and data streaming anyway.

[masteratt]

But on the other hand- Swapping disks: 20seconds.
Install: 4minutes.

[VG Aficionado]

Superior game content streaming and shorter loading times, as well as side benefit of lower hardware wear-off (since the HDD is always on anyway and the Blu-ray drive doesn't need to be so active)
>>
Relying on fragile and slower optical discs.

Not having to install the game again when you play it through one more time
>>
Having to swap discs every time.

The standard hard drive is there for developers to use it. And it's good that they use it, although Uncharted is possibly the only game that uses HDD streaming in the most efficient way (that is, having the benefits of a install without actually requiring an install).

Seriously, just because you have to wait a few minutes once doesn't mean there aren't benefits to it that wouldn't be achieved if they did it differently. However... what do both things have to do with each other anyway? Fill me in if I haven't learnt about it, but unless they actually run out of space on the disk and necessarily had to compress (as in having to install the game no matter what) the game data, multiple discs just don't have the in-game technical benefits of a HDD install. I read something about Kojima commenting they wouldn't have minded to be able to use more space, but is there any proof that they just couldn't fit any more content and had to rely on an decompression/installation?

[GTAce]

(that is, having the benefits of a install without actually requiring an install).
Oblivion installes whily playing.
It gives you some slowdoens the first minutes you play but it intalls game data while youre doing this, which is pretty cool.

EDIT: Though I think on second play through it doesn't install (at least the first Act didn't) which is nice.
Sure, the data remains on the HDD and wont get deleted until you do so.
They just split it up to the acts so that you dont have to wait 30 minutes at the start of the game. lol

[VG Aficionado]

I can be wrong, but I believe Oblivion doesn't erase the data after installing it, unlike Uncharted. I mean, Uncharted just uses the HDD as a streaming cache, and doesn't really require any extra room in the HDD unlike other games with similar tech approaches.

[Kiosko]

Finally beated it. 32 hours, Eagle Rank. Eh too many continues but what an ending! That Final Fight was amazing. And the Epilogue! Wow!!!

[Hisham]

Did my tips on outer haven help you out lol?

[err_ok]

Not having to install the game again when you play it through one more time

You have to install everytime you try a new act.. even if you have done it before. Me and a friend are playing and are on different acts... It's tedious...

[OmniCloud]

You shouldn't feel ashamed Bsack...

I'm savoring the flavor...I usually get in about 30 minutes or so during the week and really get down on the weekends. (Sometimes I have to force myself to stop playing)

With this routine, everytime I sit down with MGS4 it feels fresh all over again. Don't listen to the crazies. Savor the meal...this is probably the last one like it;)

Turning out to be one of the best games I've ever played though;)

[Gummy]

I'm liking Drebin a lot.

I just finished Act II, wow, awesome fucking game so far.

[Jasonps3]

And it's gonna get better. BELIEVE IT!

[VG Aficionado]

You have to install everytime you try a new act.. even if you have done it before. Me and a friend are playing and are on different acts... It's tedious...

That's not what I said. The second playthrough doesn't require an install.

[Hisham]

Not that 8 min install, but you still need to do an "install" (probably cacheing the requred stuff to the harddrive) at the beginning of every act on subsequent playthroughs. That is 3 mins of bullshit (for every act) right there. Why do we have to do that every single time? I would take switching discs over this. Hell, I bet if they compressed the audio and w/e else rather than leaving everything uncompressed, this probably wouldn't be an issue either.

[Sephiroth_VII]

Give it a rest, it's 3 minutes between each act.

Jesus...

[err_ok]

That's not what I said. The second playthrough doesn't require an install.

o_O You were talking about the initial install not reinstalling itself? Of course it doesn't that's completely illogical...

[Gummy]

3 minutes guys, it's a good time for a quick break or get a sandwich or masturbate... jeez! Hideo gave you guys that chance!


j/k =]

[Passive]

Yeah thats Kojimas hidden reason for puting the installs in ^^ fap time

[err_ok]

Man sony really did need to add folder support to save games or something... I have way to many mgs4 save files and they're all different people saving.

[Raitei]

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/06/26/omgs4-watch-someone-earn-big-boss-emblem-in-under-3-hours/

beating the game on the highest difficulty with no deaths, no alerts, no kills, no recovery items, no stealth suit and no special items ... all in under 5 hours.

bewarned, spoilers lay thar in video

[err_ok]

^ Jesus, i wish i could do that... Wait a minute err... he got an alert... so no big boss emblem for him... 'm confused.... Or not....

Whenever i get a quick alert noise and leave the area instantly i get an alert... This guy doesn't not fair...

I want the solar gun :) *drools*

[Sephiroth_VII]

Man sony really did need to add folder support to save games or something... I have way to many mgs4 save files and they're all different people saving.

That is why you have different user profiles ;)

[curryking1]

I know brain transfers aren't possible today, but this is fucking MGS, where people can survive crashing in a helicopter armed with explosives, and cyborg ninjas are commonplace.

It wasn't what you wrote lol, it was the way you wrote it. It was just...

What the ***k?

Lol, don't take it personally. Brown kids know how to make jokes too.

That is 3 mins of bullshit (for every act) right there. Why do we have to do that every single time?

The only reason I tolerate this at all is because it's MGS and I know there's buttloads of stuff in each act. And to play each act smoothly while keeping the install size at 3.8 or whatever GB, it needs to do this.

They could've gone with a 7 GB install I'm sure, but I'm also glad they didn't. I've come to terms with the BD drive not being fast enough to accomodate MGS as we'd like it to, and also that MGS is a game that simply requires it because it wants to do whatever the ***k it does.

I think it's a good compromise, even if it's still kind of 'bleh.' The loading screen is at least imaginative and appropriate.

If it were for any other game, I would just be like... get this ***t out of my house. Because those other games probably wouldn't be games that actually do something to say 'We need to do this because we're trying to go this far.'

And also because I wouldn't get to look at sexy Old Snake smoking a ciggy in front of me.

[Sephiroth_VII]

I usually touch myself while it's loading :look:

[Z]

just finished the games an hour ago.....wow. what can I say. it's a tremendous experience. really, this is an experience that puts to shame all other games out there. I feel I am doing it unjustace by calling it a mere 'game'. it isn't right putting it on the same level as all the other games out there. this is a Rembrandt in an elementary school art contest. this is a Shakespeare among mobile text messages. this is...something else.

also, this is truly a next generation game. I was amazed by Uncharted and R&C, but while playing this, i kepts questioning if some of it's pats were real time or prerendered. I kept looking at the Beasts ending animations and detail and my God this is the best motion capture I've ever seen. no, this isn't motion capture, this is MOTION itself!

and what a fantastic ending. it is so complete and well done, that even I, one of the biggest MGS otakus out there, said to myself; "this is it. the end. there can't be, shouldn't be a sequel. they can't ruin such a grand closing by something like that."

this game exceeds the hype. it is better than I ever imagined. until now, I looked at MGS2 as the best game to have astronomical hype and even exceeds that when released. but not anymore. MGS4 takes that position now. one which i doubt it will step off of for a long, long time. the only other contender I can think of? FF13. but we'll see how that ends up.

[Z]

speaking of loading; it is bullcrap. it is bullcrap to have individual installs, but it is unacceptable to have the same things re-install over and over each time you want to jump between acts/parts of the game. if they game can detect you not having enough space, then i can see. but to do that as default, no. my guess as why is that so is due to the extreme pressure behind the tech and release date of the giant project. seeing as how big such a project is, you can see how they might have been cornered to do stuff like that. I am sure these quirks will be fixed in the future re-release of the game- you know there will be one.

[Z]

http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa188/shmookins/_SC01005.jpg

[Segitz]

Wrong eye = fail :P

[Z]

who said I was posing as Solid? ;)

[Segitz]

who said I was posing as Solid? ;)

Oh yeah... forgot that^^

[Gummy]

that Owl avatar is distracting me...


I'm finally on ACT five.

Ahhh, I'm excited as fuck.

[Passive]

haha the owl avy is win :P

[Z]

that's my reaction to how awesome the game, nay, the experience is.
http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa188/shmookins/emos/notagain2.gif http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa188/shmookins/emos/hero.gif

[OmniCloud]

I have to agree with the not a game thing...

it's more an interactive marathon movie...

[Passive]

But still the best experience envolving a tv and a console ive ever had.

[Sephiroth_VII]

Absolutely. I see it as the directions most games should go from now on.

[iceman2654]

Just got my PS3 80GB MGS4 Bundle.

Umm....does PSI have a clan? I couldn't find the MGO thread....

[masteratt]

Absolutely. I see it as the directions most games should go from now on.
We say that after every MGS yet we get as many in the closet tough guys with 90 ton armours and a potty mouth games as ever.

[Hisham]

Because however much we like this game here... There are tons of other people who don't like the story overflowing gameplay. Normally I am the same, but if the story is good enough, I don't give a crap. Not everyone is like this though... Seriously, all games SHOULD NOT follow what MGS4 did. They should try and do there own thing... If all singleplayer games start to follow the MGS way of storytelling and such, that would have a more negative effect on gaming... Just like the way drowning the market in second rate FPS'. Ends up making tons and tons of games really bad... Last time that happened, there was the video game market crash in 1983.

[Sephiroth_VII]

Because however much we like this game here... There are tons of other people who don't like the story overflowing gameplay. Normally I am the same, but if the story is good enough, I don't give a crap. Not everyone is like this though... Seriously, all games SHOULD NOT follow what MGS4 did. They should try and do there own thing... If all singleplayer games start to follow the MGS way of storytelling and such, that would have a more negative effect on gaming... Just like the way drowning the market in second rate FPS'. Ends up making tons and tons of games really bad... Last time that happened, there was the video game market crash in 1983.

I said most(probably should've written "more") but if game creators would just get their act together and start hiring proper writers, it would bbe a huge step forwards.

[AC!D]

A magazine asked Cliffi B weather Gears of War 2 will have customization for weapons like MGS4 and Army of Two have. He responded by saying "we are not that kind of game and dont wanna be like MGS4 ever". Then he says "the sequel is gonna be more bad ass letting you blow more shit up and squish more enemies". If thats the future of gaming blowing shit up and squishing enemies then give me more MGS anyday i say and bring on the long cinematic cut scenes, endless innovative gameplay mechanics and clever boss fights.

[OmniCloud]

A magazine asked Cliffi B weather Gears of War 2 will have customization for weapons like MGS4 and Army of Two have. He responded by saying "we are not that kind of game and dont wanna be like MGS4 ever". Then he says "the sequel is gonna be more bad ass letting you blow more shit up and squish more enemies". If thats the future of gaming blowing shit up and squishing enemies then give me more MGS anyday i say and bring on the long cinematic cut scenes, endless innovative gameplay mechanics and clever boss fights.Indeed...don't get me wrong, Gears isn't another stale FPS, it put a nice polished spin on over-the-shoulder shooting. The story however is an after-thought. The game reeks with western, immature, male-oriented humor and dialog. I never finished the game on SP (got close) because of it. Played a little online--but again, I'm not the most competitive person online--more of a couch type of person.

Yeah, it may look pretty, but what is Gears 3 & 4 gonna bring to the table? Bioshock is proof, that you can go all out with graphics, yet still offer a compelling story that people will appreciate.

Unfortunately games like MGS, Sotc, Final Fantasy, Bioshock--although very popular, are becoming more and more a minority in gaming. It's ok though, sales indicate that there's a market for mature, sophisticated content. Even though LBP's story will probably be minimal/comical in nature-I would label that as a sophisticated game. To get the most out of it, you have to be a gamer, or at least learn in the process.

So I'm not worried about the trends, It just saves me money. It's easier to see a diamond in a mountain of doo-doo;)

[Hisham]

The probably isn't in the fact that they're aren't that many story based games, it is just there aren't that many GOOD story based games. Dialogue ususally sucks, with voice actors ususally being meh, and the game itself being half assed... This is because gaming is relativly young when compared to movies, and there is still a lot to be done in gaming...

And I'd like to say, you don't need long ass cutscenes to have a cinematic gaming experience... Just because MGS games do it like that, doesn't mean it is the only way. Bioshock offered a great alternative (trhough atmosphere).

MGS4 isn't the end all of cinematic gaming. New games shouldn't follow this games example to a tee... They should try different ways of telling a story rather than long ass cutscenes. That is the way gaming will grow as a medium to tell stories...

And then you have the other side of the specturm, and that is competitve gaming, and playing games just for fun rather than stories. This is how gaming started in the arcades, and most likely we won't ever see this section of gaming die because it is fun to play against people. My favourite genre (fighting games) is based wholy on competitve gaming...

Both sides of gaming need to stay because appealing to one side or the other just would hurt the market overall, really.

[Z]

There are tons of other people who don't like the story overflowing gameplay.
you missed the whole point. I don't want story overflowing games. what i want from games being like MGS is not related to the story telling at all. in fact, MGS games need serious editing and shortening. MGS4 is the best thus far, it even never has a single random or trivial codec call mid play, yet still.

what every game needs to take from the MGS experience is just that; the 'experience'. how they beautifully connect all aspects from story to character development to depth to choice and so on.

and when I say every game, I don't mean literally every single conceivable controlled sprite masquerading as a 'game' by definition, but 'every game' that falls in the area applicable- which is most of console games these days. and no, that doesn't mean the games have to be all sad. they have to have that experience that transcends simply clicking a button or watching it's effect on screen. for the rest of the 'games' out there, that may be enough for their purpose.

[OmniCloud]

+rep for the last two post--excellent reads...

Fighting genres used to be my favorite, after the original Soul Calibur it died down for me and I've been heavily invested with RPG's/Story-driven games since. I agree 100% that many titles can take something away from MGS4 into there games. The word cohesive comes to mind--but it's not even enough to describe how brilliantly cohesive MGS4 is. For people who knew the backstory of previous games--it's nothing short of amazing.

I've never felt nostalgic playing a new game before! However, for non-fans, this is still a game easily appreciated. No doubt, a second & third playthrough will have newcomers wanting to go back and play the originals lol. Also, another game, my wife loves to watch me playthrough.

I'm not even finish btw--I almost don't want to;)

[dnpmakkah]

nevermind :)

[Z]

I bet no MGS vetran did not shed a tear at the MGS1 walk down memory lane. I was so impressed by the cold and ice atmosphere and rendering. then suddenly, one of my all time favorite songs starts playing out of nowhere...then, there it is. MGS1! oh my GOD! I am playing a true MGS1 on top of the line tech! as if it was 1998 again but we didn't have PSOne, we had PS3 then! wow. amazing.

it is soooooo worth it avoiding every spoiler there is. seriously, I just went back to check all the vids I skipped out on (like the TGS and E3 ones) and damn, they ruin every single thing! everything I say! I didn't have a single clue aside of what was mentioned along the very first video of the project. and I am glad I did. everything was new, fresh and exciting. :)

[Gummy]

I really love this game.
I just finished it 2 in the morning today.

Holy shit, this game surprised me a lot.

Fighting the mantis was awesome and the end fight was hilarious.

This game has many easter eggs too.

PERFECT GAME to me.

Oh and I love the ending.

I'm playing The Boss difficulty now.
Then the hardest of course.

[Z]

I laughed so hard in three cutscenes:

-when Otacon tells you to swap the discs before continuin.
- when the colonel tells you to swap controller port.
- when psycho mantis tried to read your memory card then covers it up by trying to move your controller.

comedy gold. lol

[curryking1]

I need to know one thing...

Does Metal Gear Solid 4 support trophies?

[masteratt]

Not yet, no.

[Sephiroth_VII]

It should be easy to implement though, they already have the badges.

[masteratt]

I am kind of surprised that this game doesn't have support.

I am to lazy to check but I could have swore Kojima was "pushing" Sony to get the trophies out before MGS4 releases.
I kind of though that was because he would want to use it lol........Maybe they are keeping tight lipped.

[Sephiroth_VII]

No, there are no trophies yet. I'm guessing there will be a patch though.

[masteratt]

Well, yes...That's what I said lol.

I was just saying in my second post I was surprised since Hideo was like "Sony! Get me trophies before MGS4 comes! You go now!!"
And now trophies are here and no word from Kojima master.

[curryking1]

Just FYI all the previous MGS games have worked like that for the final badge. The credits rolling always factored into the 'playing' time. It burns... but that's how it is. :(

At least you can buy the Infinity Bandanna but that's kind of meaningless if you're reaching for the Big Boss or The Boss ranking.

Every major item in MGS2 and 3 was easily achievable through some alternate means from the grabbing Dogtags, shooting Kerotan Frogs, all the way up to catching the elusive Tsuchinoko.

The difference in MGS4 is there is no way to get The Patriot (or I have not found one) other than achieving The Boss ranking. That's what major burns to me.

I haven't gotten a 'Super' ranking in any past MGS (like no kills, no alerts, no rations, only one health bar used, under X hours type thing) but this exclusive and major item is pushing me to get the best ranking this time around.

Even if I find another way to get the Patriot, I'm still set on eventually getting my The Boss ranking - only because it's MGS and it's just such a damn good game.

[Z]

MGS5 will support trophies and Home.

[Jasonps3]

Did you guys realized that the biggest mystery in the MGS series was solved in MGS4 as the reason Liquid Snake's hair is blond? :laugh:

[Passive]

Eva :P

[Segitz]

Eva :P

Wouldn't make sense, as they put in a fertilized egg into her...

But...

I and my brother have the same partents, yet he has blue eyes (from my mother), whereas I have brown eyes (from my father). It is seldom, but it is possible to get different features, even you have the same parents.

But since they are supposed to be clones, it doesn't make sense... Only if Liquid dyed his hair :D (to look like Master Miller, perhaps?)

[masonite]

Wasn't liquid supposed to have the recessive genes, whilst Snake got the dominant ones? i remember that from MGS1, and that would explain Liquid's blonde hair. Its a recessive gene. I think its possible to have both genes, but only one will display, the other will be dormant, which explains why a a couple with dark hair can produce a baby with light hair if theres a family history.

[Passive]

Liquid had the dominant. Snake was the inferior one.

[masonite]

ah i see... well thats fucked up then.

[Passive]

There isn't any real explanation as to why liquid had blone hair as far as i know. The only thing i can possibly think of is eva, as we all knowMGS doesn't really follow rules of genetics to the letter :P

[Z]

I believe Liquid simply dyed his hair to distinguish himself from Solid. that or Shinkawa chose a different color for the same reason. I don't remember which was the more correct answer since it was a decade ago since I read it.

anyone else remember anything about that? I think it is a little bit of both, but one was the main reason behind it.

[cliffbo]

Any lingering concern you may have had that Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots would be the final Metal Gear should be laid to rest. As far as we're concerned, this all but confirms the fact that MGS will continue forward.

We had heard earlier from Ryan Payton that while MGS4 is the final chapter in Solid Snake's story, this doesn't mean another entry in the critically acclaimed stealth series isn't out of the question. In fact, at this point, Metal Gear Solid 5 will probably happen (even if it is without Snake). Franchise creator Hideo Kojima has now said it himself during an interview with Famitsu:

"I gotta start thinking about MGS5... Even though, well, Snake's story ends in MGS4. ...About MGS5, that would be something that Kojima Productions would have to make, I think." (source- Kotaku)

That's about as close to a confirmation as you're going to get right now, and it seems pretty obvious. We had heard that Kojima wanted to move on to "other projects" now that MGS4 is out the door, but as he says here, Kojima Productions would have to make MGS5. We always wondered if Kojima would turn his own creation over to another team, and we just couldn't see it happening. Well, it probably won't, and if MGS4 is the blockbuster it's supposed to be, we're willing to bet Kojima will follow up on this claim here and "start thinking about MGS5." Sweet!

http://www.psxextreme.com/ps3-news/3112.html

[masteratt]

Isn't this old news?

5/22/2008

Yep lol

I think this means he will give it to another team which is bad for me because even in his own creating MGS4, I heard Act3 was an idea of someone else and that was the bit I least enjoyed so.......

Don't think MGS can cope without Hideo.
And I'm sure it won't be called MGS5 since MGS story that Hideo created is all wrapped up.

Unless they make a stupid "play the same story from someone else's perspective" kind of bullshit which I'm sure they won't (Hideo won't let them).

[liquidlion]

I think MGS5 should revolve arould a metal gear, powered buy the newly discovered, medatron!

[LiquidEagle]

If they do make it (which is still a huge IF), Murata will be directing, which is definitely the next best man for the job, which would be nice, but MGS's fanbase shouldn't be asking for an MGS5 (or MG5) IMO.

Also, the mere fact that they're quoting Kotaku means that they don't really know shit.

[curryking1]

Liquid had the dominant. Snake was the inferior one.

Liquid had the recessive genes, but they were the genotypes that gave rise to more powerful traits.

There isn't any real explanation as to why liquid had blone hair as far as i know.

Just because neither the parents have blond hair doesn't mean the child won't get blond hair.

There's many ways. There's recessive, there's polygenic which require multiple genes to end up a certain way to result in only one distinguishable feature, and many more. And of course geneticists even know that they haven't unveiled all the secrets to the why and how of all factors which manipulate gene expression. Lamarck's theories since 2004 have been making a comeback (not actually Lamarck's, but something that's kind of similar, but really not even that similar - it has to do with gene expression as a result of experience of the environment which is not Lamarck's).

Some Indian people have the brightest blue eyes in the world. Generations before them had no phenotype that would indicate any of the offspring could have blue eyes though. It just happens through some very small chance because we all know that generally brown people are all having brown eyes. Eye colour is a highly polygenic phenotype apparently.

Shinkawa wanted to distinguish the two, but it doesn't mean the only way Liquid had blond hair was because he dyed it.

It's also easy to also pull out the reason 'something very vague and obscure occurred during the cloning which resulted in minor phenotypic differences' or some crap.

[curryking1]

I think this means he will give it to another team which is bad for me because even in his own creating MGS4, I heard Act3 was an idea of someone else and that was the bit I least enjoyed so.......

I watched the first video concerning the 'making of' MGS4... the one where it basically follows Kojima everywhere and it's quite personal... and introduces many people of course...

It introduced the guy who did the concept and creation or something of the Act 3 sneaking scene...

I was like... "I hate you... but I can't really hate you because you seem too nice... but I still hate you..."

And ya, true that Liquid, they are ***king quoting Kotaku. We know Kojima will hand down Metal Gear.

Unless they make a stupid "play the same story from someone else's perspective" kind of bullshit which I'm sure they won't (Hideo won't let them).

Hideo won't. He's too ***king awesome and wouldn't do that to us.

I don't know what they should do with Metal Gear. If anything I want them to bat a Final Fantasy home and start from scratch in a completely different universe with completely different circumstances and completely different characters.

Nothing should be the same. Don't touch Snake or Metal Gear Solid. It's ended and it was a beast.

...and in the back of my head that automatically makes it worse than MGS. Someone's gotta be damn creative to try something like I'm suggesting and pull it off.

[Jay Gee]

*snoring*

[Bull]

Isn't this old news?



Yep lol

I think this means he will give it to another team which is bad for me because even in his own creating MGS4, I heard Act3 was an idea of someone else and that was the bit I least enjoyed so.......

Don't think MGS can cope without Hideo.
And I'm sure it won't be called MGS5 since MGS story that Hideo created is all wrapped up.

Unless they make a stupid "play the same story from someone else's perspective" kind of bullshit which I'm sure they won't (Hideo won't let them).

I don't know. I mean Act 4 wasn't all that great either. It was basically running around Shadow Moses with little to do. The only standouts from Act 4 was the Crying Wolf boss fight and Rex vs. Ray...and Vamp..lol. That's 3 boss fights I know (3 of the best probably) but still...

[masteratt]

lmfao it's not "just running around Shadow Moses" jeez.
It was a nostalgic moment, one of the most emotional places to visit in the history of gaming, it was freakin' awesome.

And as you said, game's most epic battle takes place there (rex vs ray).

Act4 was my fav Act, after Act5.

[curryking1]

Act 4 and 5 were like two aces in the hole! Don't even talk ***t about them!!

*insecurity rising!*

Seriously though, ***k that!!

[HPK]

If there was another Metal Gear game coming out...well, I'd probably be skeptical of it since I wouldn't know what to think. No Snake? It just wouldn't feel the same.

But...an idea I'd like to see in some form: Say Naked Snake never killed The Boss. How would the world have turned out if she lived from that confrontation?

[Segitz]

I dunno, I REALLY REALLY liked Act 3... tbh, gamewise, it was nearly my favourite (well... all of them were my favourite, except the beginning of Act 5... which basically had me running and gunning for the door, as those stupid Frogs always killed me)

[Segitz]

If Snake really had only the recessive genes, he would be a walking "syndromes" machine...^^

I mean, many MANY syndromes and hereditairy diseases are passed on recessively, so that the other parent cancels them out (this is also why some of those can only target either male or female... different chromosomes XX or XY)...

I know I know, it's a sci fi story and to be honest, MGS is the one that at least makes mostly sense... looking at other games AND movies out there, they make MUCH worse mistakes.

[HPK]

Liquid had the recessive genes, but they were the genotypes that gave rise to more powerful traits.

If memory serves me well, Solid actually has the recessive genes and Liquid had the dominant ones. However, the two of them were raised differently. See, Solid was raised in a normal way, but had no idea his brother existed. Liquid was brought up to be think he was the inferior of the two. He was told he had the worst of the genes and was worth nothing.

[Passive]

haha you are meant to stealth act 5 :P


Wouldn't say this is "confirmed" either :P thats a stetch.

[masteratt]

haha you are meant to stealth act 5 :P
I tried that in my first SEVENTY ZILLION TRIES! before saying "fuck it" and then I just run and gun for the door like Segitz did.
And it worked like on my 3rd try lol.

In Act 5: Action > Stealth

[Passive]

um, i tried running and gunning :P and got owned serveral times over so i stealthed it :P much more fun imo. just stuck to the ground, crawled, knew where all the patrol positions were and times the gekko routs. I loved that part ^^

[venomv]

Yeah, I tried the first few times running and gunning and it didn't work out so well....

[OmniCloud]

They could make a Metal Gear 5--just do a prequel...I'm pretty sure working with a base story/scenery would be easier to expand on.

[Matt]

Definitely, and it's not like they would have to do anything with the gameplay, except maybe make it so that he doesn't pull items out of his arse, George Stobbard-style.

[Passive]

But thats part of the comedy side :P watch snake pull a stinger out of a hat.

[Z]

Liquid had the recessive genes, but they were the genotypes that gave rise to more powerful traits.



Just because neither the parents have blond hair doesn't mean the child won't get blond hair.

you're not thinking in anime/game methodology: you kid has to have the exact same hair and eye color plus, his clothing will be extremely similar, if not identical, to his prominent parent.
he didn't know the 4th was Naruto's father? seriously now.

[curryking1]

^^Could've been HPK, that's just the one I've always been under the impression of.

^Ya you kind of figure that when Raiden's son looks like such a fruit cake. That whole scene was completely lame. OMG he lieks swordz too!!! WOW that's really emotional /lame

[Passive]

Yeah what was with little john having hair like vergil? O.o

[Xclusion]

I finally beat it!

AAA.

[masteratt]

Yeah that Raiden's son scene made me laugh. It was embarrassingly bad.
Actually the whole Raiden family thing was cheesy as fuck.
The only awesome thing about it was what Campbell did ;)

[Xclusion]

Don't know how to do spoilers so for anyone that hasn't beaten it yet stop reading:

Was I the only one yelling at snake why he had to keep going during the microwave seen. Going through the history of MGS and telling him what each character they showed on the upper screen meant to him?

[masteratt]

I was screaming at that bit. too.....GO SNAKKKKEE!!!!!SNAKE GO!!! DON'T FUCKING DIE SNAKEE!!!!!!!! GOOOOO SNAKE YOU CAN MAKE IT SNAKE GO!!!!!!!!!!!! *frantically taps button*!!!

I think that was the best bit of the game.

And the ocelot/ liqid fight.

[Passive]

haha i think we were all shouting.

me: COME OOONNNNN!!!! FUUUUUCCCCCCKK!!! GO SNAKE!! COME ON!! SHIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTT!!!!!!!



Yeah the ocelot fight was pure brilliance. that was divided by zero :P

[Z]

for that scene, I took a trip to Mexico and got me an eye surgery so I can watch both a Snake being baked alive and also two kick-ass characters fight each other, chameleon style!


The only awesome thing about it was what Campbell did ;)

banging a chick younger than your daughter? hell yea!

oh come on, you know he tapped that.

[LiquidEagle]

I found these on the game's official website, these weren't up for a long time and I just noticed them up now, I've read the first one about Research, and I'm gonna read the other two after I post them :)

Hideo Kojima Interview Part One: Research (http://www.konami.jp/mgs4/us/interview/01.html)

Q: Before creating each game in the MGS series, you spent a lot of time doing research.
Kojima:
Starting with MGS1, yeah. It's the same basic idea as with movies or novels. You go on location, you do solid research, and then you start creating. The graphics capabilities in games have gotten better and better ever since the PlayStation came out, and I figured I had to start doing it that way.
Back then, if you said you were doing research for a game, people would look at you and say "Doing WHAT?" But the CEO at the time was pretty sharp, and he agreed that that was the way it had to be done.
So I enlisted the help of Motosada Mori and gathered up material on U.S. military bases, SWAT training, weapons, and things like that. That was the first one, and for later games we went to wherever the game was set - New York for "2", and the jungles of Yakushima for "3". And I got actual military training from Mori-san, too.


Q: What kind of research did you do for "4"?
Kojima:
"4" isn't set in any specific country, but we went around to countries that were close to what we were imagining. We also did the full package of military training, and then took the training one step further.
Q: What do you mean by "the full package"?
Kojima:
People like Shin-chan who've been with MGS all along already knew how to handle a gun and stuff, but there were lots of new staff this time around who didn't know the first thing. So we started with the basics, and by the end we were getting a taste of the most advanced training in the world, and we put what we got out of that into the game.
Q: What kind of training was it?
Kojima:
Scout training, things like that. I'm not allowed to say much because of nondisclosure agreements, but it was mostly stuff on psychological warfare, seeing how people operate under psychological stress, and some Eastern stuff that was supposed to sharpen our senses. We did things like see if you could get out of a room with your eyes closed.
We started out with classroom-type lectures that everybody had to attend, including those who didn't know anything. Then we had an overnight training camp on psychological warfare. After that we had another overnight camp for general stuff like weapons training and searching. Almost all of us did that one, too. The final training session was quite advanced, or rather dangerous, so only the main staff members attended. This one was in the mountains over two days. It was scout training, so we painted our faces with mud and camouflaged all our gear by hand.


Q: Why did you decide to include these kind of psychological and Eastern elements?
Kojima:
In every MGS up until now, you're in a place where everybody's the enemy. Because you're sneaking into enemy territory.
For "4" we took it further. We started with the concept that you're sneaking into a war zone where you're surrounded by PMCs and militias who are fighting battles that have nothing to do with Snake. But he can use their psychological state to his advantage and get through parts easier. We thought, in order to incorporate that idea into the game we needed to study this kind of psychological aspect ourselves. In the end we didn't make it that complicated so it'd be easy to understand. But we still included some of those elements. Each solider has his or her own "emotion factor". Like if a weak-kneed soldier sees his comrades getting killed, he might get scared and run away.
Q: Before everybody used to react the same way, but now you're able to render each individual soldier's emotions and personality.
Kojima:
But the PMCsare controlled by nanomachines. They can get emotionally worked up, but only to a certain extent. Only the ones who don't have nanomachines can go all the way to the limit. They start screaming and fainting, foaming at the mouth, showing us how terrifying the battlefield really is.
There's also the BB Corps, these monsters created based on four different emotions, and they're another reason why we wanted to get close to the psychological aspects of the battlefield.
Real militaries are starting to put a lot of importance on it, too. In developed countries it's getting to be standard procedure to have counselors in your units just like you have medics.
Rose from "2" is back this time as a psychological counselor in a combat stress platoon.


Q: Is that kind of counseling effective out on real battlefields?
Kojima:
Absolutely. In "4" there's a Psyche Gauge below the LIFE Gauge. It's kind of like the Stamina Gauge in "3", but different things can make your Psyche go down - for instance, standing around too long in a hot or cold place, or being chased by the enemy in Alert Phase, or killing too many people. These things increase your stress and lower your Psyche, which has a variety of effects.
And Rose, as your counselor, can tell you what to do in those situations if you ask her, like eat something hot when you're in a cold place, or drink something cold when it's hot, or listen to music. Little things, but they're worked into the game design.
And as you play and you have to worry about these things, you start to get a sense of what mental health care means on the battlefield.
Q: Your stress rises when you kill people?
Kojima:
Soldiers are human, too. Even Snake will get sick and throw up if he kills too much. There's also what's called a "combat high" where you get a prolonged adrenalin rush, but when it's over, watch out.
Q: The new Threat Ring emphasizes those mental aspects as well.
Kojima:
I think today's cutting-edge technology's already there. In essence, the ultimate soldier is something close to a ninja. Like The End in "3" - one with the forest. Snake and the PMCs might have high-tech gear, but the mental part of combat, the SENSE, is still essential.
* Threat Ring


Q: I hear you went to three different countries.
Kojima:
This is the PS3, and people expect the backgrounds to be extremely detailed and realistic. So we went to three locations: Morocco, Peru, and Prague.
We had about 6 or 7 people go to each spot, usually me, the backgrounders, and the scripters.
And we also went to a bunch of other places - a foundry, drainage tunnels, military shows.
Q: What kinds of material did you collect from these places?
Kojima:
Video, of course, and photos in the tens of thousands. We recorded sounds, too, and used all of these for 3D modeling and stuff. Photos alone don't give you a real sense of being there. So we walked around town from dawn until dusk, went to all kinds of places, getting a feel for the smell, the atmosphere, local products, local food. We collected all these things and then thought about what to put into the game. You don't really know what you need to get that sense of being there until you've actually been there. Of course nowadays we can go to the library or the Internet if we want photos. But that's not going to tell you how a place smells, or how hot it is.

In Peru, the crew got altitude sickness so bad most of us couldn't even move (laughs). But it's essential that we have that kind of experience ourselves before we put it in the game. Normally when you go to a country, the people there only show you the good parts. But we weren't interested in seeing those parts. We wanted to see the garbage-strewn back alleys, scenes like that. And we were determined to see them no matter what. No actual battlefields, of course, but past battlefields and such.


Q: Why did you spend so much time on research?
Kojima:
Well, there's a big difference between recreating something when you've seen it in person and when you haven't, that's all. Say you're trying to create a Middle Eastern scene. You could use your imagination, or look at a photo somebody else took, but you're going to end up with something pretty shallow. I know, you're probably thinking, "You were there, what, a week? What do you know?" (laughs) But still, having seen it in person makes a huge difference. Seeing the actual place, talking to the people who actually live there, experiencing it for yourself; these things really are crucial when you're creating something, I think. They're an essential part of the process of making entertainment.
And it's something that's really lacking in Japanese entertainment, even in novels and stuff.
Q: There aren't many games in the industry that have this much research put into them.
Kojima:
Probably because of the time and money involved. And yet in other countries it's a given.
Like if the main character in a novel is a doctor, the author follows doctors around and learns about everything they do, and then writes based on that experience.
If things continue like this, there's no way Japanese content can compete with that. Although to be fair, over there they can do it because they only have to write one book a year. In the Japanese light novel industry, you might get stuck writing one every two months. At that rate, all you can write is boring high-school dramas and pure fantasies.

[LiquidEagle]

Hideo Kojima Interview Part Two: Development (http://www.konami.jp/mgs4/us/interview/02.html)

Q: The motion capture for MGS4 took 4 months, including prep time.
Kojima:
I know, it's unprecedented. There was just so much of it to shoot (laughs). And there are some special demos this time where the player can move the camera around. To do that, we had to do a 10-plus minute scene in one take. If we had to retake something, we had to do the whole scene over from the beginning. That's probably one reason why it took so long. Also, the motion actors trained with Mori-san - just 1 or 2 days, but they learned everything from how to hold a gun to how to walk. In Hollywood, this kind of stuff is normal.
Q: Some of the action is pretty intense. Did most of the actors have an action background?
Kojima:
It depended on the role of the character - we had both action-type actors and stage-type actors. Like for Raiden, we used different actors for the action parts and the dramatic parts.


Q: This time around you recorded the motion capture and the voices in reverse order.
Kojima:
We used to always record the voices first and then add the motion capture. But with resolution this high you can see the smallest details, so if we recorded the voices first it'd end up feeling disjointed and hard to act out.
So for the motion capture in MGS4 we thought we'd start by first recording the motions and facial expressions and voices all at once. It was tough on the actors, but we made them do all the complicated MGS dialogue, plus the 10-plus minute scenes in one take (laughs).
Of course, there's motion and then there's facial expressions, and when you do a crying scene, you have to rest half an hour before you can do another take.
Which is exactly like a movie. And then we dubbed over that footage.
Q: So you filmed the facial expressions at the same time?
Kojima:
There's something called facial capture technology, which is in the same category as motion capture, only it captures facial expressions. We tried using it for the trailer, but it wasn't very efficient, so we used a regular camera for the facial expressions and had our animators render them by hand.
Q: You had actual human models pose for the BB Corps and used them for the 3D models.
Kojima:
The face of an actual person tells the story of his or her life. The BBs are monsters, which is a surreal concept, but that's exactly why we incorporated living, breathing human beings, to accentuate the realism.
Q: How did it feel when you actually put them into the game?
Kojima:
They were truly frightening. I've already shown them to around 100 game writers around the world, and people were covering their mouths and saying, "Scary!"
The idea of beautiful women being monsters is a common motif in Japanese horror. So Japanese people might be more used to it. But people in other countries have never seen it before, and it's like they don't know what to do. I consider that reaction a success. They might even be the scariest ever (laughs).


Q: The MGS series has a unique balance between realistic elements and purely fictional elements.
Kojima:
Well, to put it in simpler terms, it treads a fine line between Western movies and Japanese anime. Somewhere between Akiba and Hollywood (laughs).
Q: It's rare to see such a fusion of Akiba and Hollywood sensibilities.
Kojima:
Although it does fall more on the movie side. Like "The Matrix" and "Hellboy", for instance.


Q: MGS4 has a massive amount of sound effects. I hear they took 100 days and 120 different specialized tools to record.
Kojima:
Yeah, we built our own in-house Foley studio. And apparently the MGS team are the only ones using it.
Q: What kind of studio was it?
Kojima:
Let's see... It's got a lot of square footage. It has planking and stone, and mud and sand, and places for storing water and stuff. And lots of shoes, too. We had one Foley artist, and to make footsteps sounds for women and children, he'd set his butt on a bar overhead and adjusted his weight and stuff. We also had bamboo leaves, and cloth to make the sound of clothes rustling, and doors and things like that. All different kinds of doors. The same as you'd find in a Hollywood Foley studio.
Q: But you didn't use Hollywood sounds this time, you made your own in-house.
Kojima:
Our Foley artist was a Konami staffer. He used to do sound effects for movies, and he's been with us since "2".
You know how you want to make little tweaks right up until the last minute? It's nice when you've got a studio right next door and it's always open for you to use (laughs).
We did the post-recording in-house, too. If we wanted to re-record something, we could do it right away. It's the Peter Jacksonsystem. We did do part of the mixing in Hollywood, though, at Skywalker Ranch .
Q: How did you like Skywalker Ranch?
Kojima:
It's an amazing place. It's in the middle of the mountains, and there's no sign or anything marking the entrance. But there's lots of places to eat and stuff inside.
And there's lots of studios with names of different movie directors. So we had a guy there named Christopher Boyes, who was the mixer for "Lord of the Rings", do the mixing for us. Not for all the scenes, though, because there was a ton of material, and he used a synthesizer there's only 5 of in the entire world. There were scenes that had 150 or so sounds layered in. It's tough to do it justice in words, but mixing can create a whole different sound. Some Japanese movies use Skywalker Studios, too, but apparently most of them hand it over to the folks there and OK whatever they do. But I bombarded them with retakes (laughs). And they did a great job making it to order.


Q: You collaborated with a number of other foreign creators as well.
Kojima:
Yeah, Harry-san did the sound. He's been with us since "2". But he's been busy with "Narnia" and stuff, and I was afraid we weren't going to be able to get him. But I was in Hollywood on other business and dropped by to see him, and he said, "I saw the trailer. Probably 100 times. I already have a theme in mind." (laughs) So I said "Sounds great" and asked him to do it.We also got Alex from Logan, and Kyle-san who did those iPod commercials, both of whom are outstanding talents.
We had those guys do something special for the intro of the game - I can't say what yet, though.
Q: How did it feel to develop for the PS3?
Kojima:
Yeah, some foreign magazine was writing, "Hideo Kojima is not satisfied with the PS3's specs!", right?
The West doesn't have a culture of modesty, and so when you're modest people take it literally. It's like you have to be like "I am the greatest!" all the time.
And then it goes through the interpreter and gets translated, and printed in some other magazine, and then retranslated back into Japanese. And it's not the nuance of what I said at all. But now it can't be corrected. It's a real headache.
When a creator hears the word "specs", he tends to overimagine things. Like if you tell him "OK, now you'll be able to fly", he'll go off thinking "Sounds like I can break the sound barrier, maybe even go into outer space." Then when they actually make it, it's only a one-step advance instead of ten. But that one step is important. Then you start imagining the next ten steps, and even if you only end up moving one more step forward, that's two steps you've advanced. And sooner or later you do reach that tenth step.

[LiquidEagle]

Hideo Kojima Interview Part Three: Themes (http://www.konami.jp/mgs4/us/interview/03.html)

Q: "Gene", "meme", and "scene" have each been themes of previous MGS titles. Can you elaborate on that?
Kojima:
MGS has an "anti-war, anti-nuke" message throughout the series, but its main theme has been what we should and ultimately do pass on to future generations. MGS1 talks about genes, and in MGS2 you have memes, or the information that isn't encoded into our genes.
Originally that was going to be the entire scope of the theme, but when we decided to do MGS3 I thought about exactly what it is we should pass on. Even if you want to pass on the rightmemes, the criteria for selecting those memes changes with the times. For instance, in the Heian period, women with jowls were considered beautiful, but that isn't the case nowadays, is it? I set the game in the past in order to examine that selection process.
Q: The theme of MGS4 is "sense". What exactly does that mean?
Kojima:
Once again I'd intended for MGS3 to wrap up the series, but so many people wanted to know what happened after "2". Things like the identity of the Patriots and so forth. I had planned on leaving those mysteries as mysteries, but people weren't convinced that the series was wrapped up.
So ultimately we ended up making "4". When work started on it, though, I began to wonder if my message of what we should pass on to future generations had truly gotten through, both to players and my team. After all, I've been conscious of the fact that this really is going to be my final Metal Gear, which means the team is going to have to continue the series themselves after I step away.
However, it hit me that maybe there are some things you can't pass on. A person's will, thoughts, and emotions aren't encoded into their genes, and they aren't a part of memes either. If you group together those remaining factors, you're left with a person's sense, and that's the theme of the game this time around.
That's why this is definitely my last Metal Gear and the end of Solid Snake's story. There probably will be a Metal Gear Solid 5, but it'll more than likely have a different world, characters, and story.
Q: Do you think one's sense truly can't be passed on?
Kojima:
I think that even though you might not be able to describe something in words, it's important to show it indirectly. No matter how often a parent tells their child they shouldn't misbehave or that they should smarten up, the child usually doesn't listen, do they?
So I had Snake, who continues to fight despite his age, live by example instead of offering a direct message. It's like a father going out and working hard every day to provide for his child rather than simply telling them he loves them. In the game Meryl and other characters tell Old Snake he doesn't have to fight, that they'll take over for him. But Snake continues to fight. That's what he wants to pass on. Of course, they may not realize it while he's still alive.
Q: The image of Old Snake and the "sense" theme dovetail together, but which came first?
Kojima:
I'd say neither came first. These two ideas born simultaneously but separately just fit together nicely, though perhaps in my mind the two had been connected from the start.
You also have an older EVA and Liquid, whose actions have forced others into action. It's the responsibility of the older generation to fix those mistakes, and then the younger generation grows up witnessing them taking that responsibility. That nuance is part of the reason the game has these older characters in it.
Q: Would you say Old Snake has the same mindset as yourself?
Kojima:
Yeah, I'd say he does. We're both old but we both think we have nice asses for our age (laughs).

:lol: at that last quote!

"There probably will be a Metal Gear Solid 5, but it'll more than likely have a different world, characters, and story." is also interesting in a way, it's not confirmation of the game's existence, but it's a good indication that there won't be some BS happening where Solid Snake is called back into action when he's supposed to be dead or something, y'know?

[Passive]

Yeah, I'd say he does. We're both old but we both think we have nice asses for our age


lol! love it, goes in the sig.

[r33hash]

I'm going to be borrowing a friend's PS3 for two weeks while he's out of the country. Think I can beat MGS4 in 2 weeks time?

[Passive]

Yes :P easily

[Hisham]

Easily if you have 20 to 25 hours to put into the game within the 2 weeks.

[JasonXe]

Ohh Sackboy already sent his portfolio to star in MGS5.

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:anGl7dPV2QXETM:http://www.littlebigfan.com/images/basketsnake/solidsnake2tn.jpg

[Hisham]

If there was another Metal Gear game coming out...well, I'd probably be skeptical of it since I wouldn't know what to think. No Snake? It just wouldn't feel the same.

But...an idea I'd like to see in some form: Say Naked Snake never killed The Boss. How would the world have turned out if she lived from that confrontation?

I'd like to see this.

Sure it would be a non canon, what if story, but it would be nice to see what would have unfolded if The Boss had stayed alive.

[TimmyJ]

How bout some single player DLC loving first?

[masteratt]

Yeah they should make available an ending where you press R1 and make Snake shoot himself.

Just to see how it works.

[masonite]

I'd like to see this.

Sure it would be a non canon, what if story, but it would be nice to see what would have unfolded if The Boss had stayed alive.

If memory serves, theres some loud music and someone says "snake? snake? SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!" and thats the end. Not sure if you coul