A Suggestion for this forum

[Siraris]

I have been seeing the NPD numbers around a lot today, as they were just released, and it made me think of something. These numbers do no good for anyone in the gaming community, period. The only people that these numbers matter to are the publishers, the retailers and the console manufacturers, and that's IT. Yet with the publication of these numbers, there has been a small army of arm-chair analysts created, who think that they somehow have some sort of insight into how the industry works.

All of the people who try and analyze numbers, and who make posts like "DU U THINK ITZ SMRT THAT SONY DROPPED THE 20 GIG MODAL WITH THE LATEST NUMBERZ" are just making things worse on gaming forums. Sony has quite a few very smart people who work for them, who have access not only to the numbers we see, but the real numbers that we don't see which tell the true story. It is their job to look at the numbers, and reference them with what the core strategy of the company is. We have no clue how much they are losing per system, we have no clue what their margins are, we have no clue how many systems are actually selling or what the software attachments are, we have no clue what projections are, how many they predicted to sell, ANYTHING like that. These numbers are only there to create flame wars and trolling, as people can say "HEE HEE PS3 IS DOING SHITTY LOL IT FAILS WII FTW!".

It is starting to drive me absolutely up the wall that these numbers are posted, and so my recommendation for this forum is to lock and delete any thread or post that relates to any published numbers from now on.

Just to reiterate, we are here to talk about games, and we have enough things to argue about without having to factor in totally meaningless numbers. I don't think I can really have much sway on a site like 1UP, or IGN, to have these posts stopped from being made, but on here, I feel like most people will agree with me and a consensus can be reached.

I really think the only people who actually want to see these numbers are people who want to troll or flame forums, as theres nothing else that you can realistically extract from them.

Anyways, just a thought to improve this little corner of the web just a little bit more.

[kaphwan]

You raise a good point.

Of course, the best option would be to shoot all of the real analysts who also happen to know nothing about what's happening, as the threads that start from there tend to generate, like, 3 or 4 good posts tops.

*doesn't hold breath*

[LaLiLuLeLo]

I thought about this earlier today. Questioning the productivity of such threads. I mean, how much is there to talk about besides the obvious?

"Uh oh, so and so is doomed, they better do xyz because I'm an expert!"
or
"Dang they're selling like crazy!"

And just 5 pages of echoing sentiment and bickering.

[n1n9tean]

^exactly why I made the suggestion that there be a SPECIFIC sub-forum just for GAMING (i.e. playing games and having fun, calling out other members for a duel or creating clans, etc.) where such talk is NOT ALLOWED. I made it in that thread you created to get rid of some stickeys, LaLiLuLeLo.

Then I realized that we're already set up for the idea. We just need the main sections to be open for posting (Sony Gaming, Nintendo Gaming, etc.)

[curryking1]

I personally like to look at numbers and analyze them, that's one of the things I like to do. I like to look at trends. Some people make some stupid arguments and comments though, that's the annoying part.

What's so wrong about saying "whoa they are selling great, good for them!" It's as repetitive as saying "Whoa check out this new game!" I think it's fun to see how successful some things are, and I enjoy praising those things that are successful, and looking at why somethings aren't doing well. I like seeing what exactly is currently 'going down' in terms of what's hot and what's not.

[Viper]

It's funny, I just started a prediction league and it seems we have many that guestimate just as well as the high paid analysts.

On top of that, there are many subjects that can be deduced as negative for one factor and positive for others such as a game going multiplatofrm that was previously exclusive.

If we restrict sales figures just because they can be construed in a negative manner for certain groups then so too must go any and all news, repostings, speculations or anything else of that matter that could be considered negative to one group over others.

[Diresu]

While I agree with the base idea...if noone starts a thread...then its bound to be brought up in another thread where it doesn't belong. Considering these numbers are all over the place on release..its hard to miss if you are on the net.

[masteratt]

Well if you visit forums like this, you should expect those kinds of threads as well.

Many people do like discussing them and putting themselves in the shoes of Sony just like many people like to analyse every inch of a screenshot and many people like going back and forth trying to change each other's opinions.

I don't think any action should be taken against this since if you look at the core of internet forums, everyone is always discussing things without any real reason or source.

[curryking1]

It's funny, I just started a prediction league and it seems we have many that guestimate just as well as the high paid analysts.

On top of that, there are many subjects that can be deduced as negative for one factor and positive for others such as a game going multiplatofrm that was previously exclusive.

If we restrict sales figures just because they can be construed in a negative manner for certain groups then so too must go any and all news, repostings, speculations or anything else of that matter that could be considered negative to one group over others.

I completely agree with the whole post.

[n1n9tean]

Just to clarify myself..hahaha...I don't give a SH*T about sales figures as a gamer. So, when I said "that's exactly why...etc" I wasn't saying that's why we need to prevent people from saying "Uh oh, so and so is doomed" as lalilulelo's example stated. I was just offering a solution that would keep us GAMERS from being bothered by all the BS we don't care about. Including all the brand wars. If there was a place where only games we are playing are allowed to be discussed (and calling others out in challenges in those games be it for high scores or multiplayer) then there would be no conflict other than "you think that game is fun? Well, you're wrong, I think it sucks."

EDIT: Also, page 2 of the "Stickeys May Cry" thread (at the very bottom) is where I started talking about the solution. I can't post a link (on PS3); so, I tell you where it is.

[Gegenki]

I thought about this earlier today. Questioning the productivity of such threads. I mean, how much is there to talk about besides the obvious?

"Uh oh, so and so is doomed, they better do xyz because I'm an expert!"
or
"Dang they're selling like crazy!"

And just 5 pages of echoing sentiment and bickering.

^ I agree
<reiterates in more lines>

on n1n9tean's point maybe we could have a self pruning board for that sort of thing. Threads will probably die quickly but you wouldn't make a thread like that normally. For example. I got resistance last week and the internet this week and I still don;t know who here is playing resistance but I wouldn't post it on the PS3 forum because I'd end up making a direct question that would die quickly as a thread.

[Siraris]

It's funny, I just started a prediction league and it seems we have many that guestimate just as well as the high paid analysts.

On top of that, there are many subjects that can be deduced as negative for one factor and positive for others such as a game going multiplatofrm that was previously exclusive.

If we restrict sales figures just because they can be construed in a negative manner for certain groups then so too must go any and all news, repostings, speculations or anything else of that matter that could be considered negative to one group over others.

I think we should restrict all posts, whether it be starting topics or in other threads, of numbers. It's totally useless. Hell, NPD doesn't even include Walmart, which could account for another 100,000 systems on there, and some other major retailers.

If Sony has projected 150k units per month for the Q1 2007, then they are doing just fine, but we'll never know that. So what's the point of discussing ANY numbers.

[Viper]

The validity of NPD's numbers are debating countless times. To sum up, they've perfected their estimating process pretty damn well and it's purchased by corporations for thousands of dollars a piece. If Sony, Nintendo and MS buy them and trust them, who are we to suggest otherwise? You stated before exactly who they matter to and now you're questioning their validity. Do you not trust that publishers, developers, etc...would ensure the figures they base millions of dollars upon is faulty or not?

We'll never know for certain the technical capabilities of the PS3 but we continue to discuss them. Should we stop that as well?

Uncertainty not only is the very purpose for discussion but without uncertainty, we'd have no reason to ever post at all. A game would be either good for certain with no potential for others to dislike it, therefore why discuss anything regarding it when in principle we all know it to be good already?

It is the difference of opinion, the uncertainty of everything, the variations of what makes something positive or negative that ensures enjoyment.

[frosty]

Though I agree that we shouldn't focus on numbers, keeping up with them is still good for the sake of discussion.

[Lost|Identity]

I think that the numbers you use are irrelevant in as far as interpretation goes, either they are true or they are not. The problem is that there are countless ways to interpret the data that is given. You could look at the March NPD and say that Sony is still only selling around 130,000 a month in America, or you could look at it and say that they are the only console to sell more in March the in the previous months of 2007, or you could twist that a little and say they are the only ones that didn't have a DROP in sales, or ... I think you get it.

My point is that you can only form your own idea of what such information means and even if those numbers are absolutely correct the interpretations are not necessarily consistent with any form of truth.

[woundingchaney]

I view the forum as the contemplation and discussion of Sony be it good or bad. The NPD numbers and other tracking data as well are an integral part in tracking Sonys progress this gen., if one wishes not to pay attention to them then that is their choice although it is information none the less and should be posted in general gaming or whatever relevant board. How one wishes to view the numbers is as well up to them.

This discussion would not exist if Sony led in the NPD sales or other such sales tracking. In years Sony may lead in such tracking estimates, would we not want the numbers listed then??

[Z]

personally, I would rather comment or take seriously figures of an extended time rather than something like weekly or even monthly at some occasions. every three months would be good to see how the industry is doing, for example.

having that said, I see no problem of issuing, seeing or talking about shorter figure windows. I am saying that I, myself, won't go into discussions about them. that doesn't mean others shouldn't knock themselves up for it. what ever peels your banana.

[venomv]

I love looking at how the different systems and games are doing, but if I don't want to for whatever reason, I don't click the link....